Re: Request for active moderation

morningsun76 wrote:

I'm replying to comments from another thread.

lyra wrote:
Haven wrote:

The Icke forum has a great code of conduct:

Um, Haven?   Just because the Icke forum has those rules, doesn't mean everybody abides by them.

In fact.......far from it.

I registered with the Icke forum, but decided to not be an active member there due to all the nonsense, fighting, cussing, personal insults and all around, neverending negativity that was going on there.  That place gives me a major headache.    So much so that I can't even go there just to read.   It's that bad.

Having a publicly posted "code of conduct" and having members who actually follow it are two totally different things.  There's NO moderation going on over at the Icke forum, the last time I checked, which was several weeks ago.  "Harris" is supposed to be the moderator, but Harris seems to be MIA.

But don't everybody take my word for it.   Meander over there and have a look for yourselves.

And that is the reason why most of us don't spend any time at the David Icke forum, or on Usenet, or many others.  Some of us have better things to do with our time than bother weeding through countless posts by other people whose purposes, integrity and standards of conduct do not match our own.  The only reason I personally frequent this particular forum is that it is unique in expecting a much higher standard from its members than anything else I've yet found.

Like it has been stated above, having a code of conduct and actually following it are two different things, yes, but I still feel it is a great code of conduct.  I never commented on what actually goes on there.  I sometimes have to weed through half a page to an entire page of personal argument garbage here, too, which makes me just quit the thread instead of taking the time to sift through all the noise for a valuable insight.  I'd rather read about what's actually being discussed than how somebody is something or other.

* When we start identifying wisdom with our ability to comprehend its form, what wisdom is that?
* Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
* People want platitudes, not progress.

Re: Request for active moderation

Alright, I have an idea.  When I started this forum, I had a category called "Battle Arena" and removed it soon because it was a joke. Little did I know how handy this would have been later on. 

So how about a forum category called "Free for All", which will have no moderation except for obvious stuff like spam or porn? If a thread elsewhere degenerates into total anarchy then it can be moved there. Or if someone can't stand the "draconian" moderation policy at NR, they can start a thread there and not worry about it.

Acquiring fringe knowledge is like digging for diamonds in a mine field.

48 (edited by SednaSphere 2005-10-11 14:41:15)

Re: Request for active moderation

I remember when blackbox was on here, and I was the "chump" that fell for his schtick, mea culpa. I later learned, from observation, and from gaining more experience on internet boards, which I was then new to, just how destructive such individuals can be. I guess what I fell for was the flattery. I was feeling unsure of myself at the time, and although I have often felt similar feelings since, I learned my lesson. I felt stupid at first, but that's how you learn, eh? As far as the latest things go, to me they have gotten so bad as to be bordering on ridiculous, and some people go on their so-called "intellectual" pomposity trips, never realizing how asinine they sound, and then feeding the feeders even more. Having been here since the beginning, I can vouch for Montalk's latest observations about how bad things can get. It's one thing to have an exciting debate, another to have vaingloriously naive or vicious jerks sneakily doing their jerk-around machinations at every burp. Even something someone says in the Fun section becomes fodder for incredibly boring and pedantic drivel by some brain-fevered poseur trying to prove they are better than you.

OH-MY-GOD please make it stop.

Re: Request for active moderation

Sedna, you're right.   My feeling has been to step up and be the bad guy rather than just let it go.  To whatever extent that's served to add fuel to the fire and "feed the feeders" more, that's a bad thing for sure and I am sorry for it.   If I had caught on to the intentional lack of moderation from the beginning, I'd have refrained from all comments on the subject, period.   My bad for missing or forgetting the announcement.  I hope the orchestrated drama served its intended purpose and was worth it.

50 (edited by wandering1 2005-10-11 08:33:56)

Re: Request for active moderation

montalk wrote:

Alright, I have an idea.  When I started this forum, I had a category called "Battle Arena" and removed it soon because it was a joke. Little did I know how handy this would have been later on. 

So how about a forum category called "Free for All", which will have no moderation except for obvious stuff like spam or porn? If a thread elsewhere degenerates into total anarchy then it can be moved there. Or if someone can't stand the "draconian" moderation policy at NR, they can start a thread there and not worry about it.

There was a great deal of discussion on the "Battle Arena" idea a while back and I think the result was that almost everybody thought that we are better off without it.

Montalk, I think that you are doing a fine job at moderation and I think that a lot of people agree with me on that point.

Also, I think that other people have stepped up to voice opinions with regard to behavior on the forum, so that hopefully the responsibility is not all on one person.

:-)

Re: Request for active moderation

I agree, and that's why I can't wait for it to start again. Morningsun, I didn't feel anything negative towards your posts. As you know, there've
been some really wrong things done on this board, and it would take a saint not to react to some of it, to some extent. Some feel that they are
saints by ignoring it, however, what we need is courage in speaking up
each time, before things really begin to be harmful to people. As to what Montalk's doing with the moderation break, I'm sure there's a good reason for it, and I don't question it, really. But what's happened in the last week really proves his point that the cowards run amok if they feel they can get away with it, and it's for those who doubt the reasoning for his bans that I am making these statements. It bothers me, and I know it bothers many others...only a few more days to go, and I will be curious to see any conclusions he reaches. If he chooses to continue to also be hilariously funny about it in some of his comments, all the better.
We are due for a real "chuckle." (hint.)

Re: Request for active moderation

SednaSphere: I find it harmful to post things like "there've been some really wrong things done on this board" without citing specifics.  Since I've done "wrong things" it makes me wonder of course IF you are referring to me -- and since others have probably done what they might feel are "wrong things" then perhaps they are wondering IF you are referring to them.

In other words, when generalities are given -- it gets others concerned -- they get "gun shy" wondering ... oh ... am I being singled out?

So -- specifics please OR when you post something, be as clear as you possibly can - don't bring up the past, deal with things in the moment ... and if you object to people ignoring what is going on (and calling them saints obliquely) then do you object to the approximately 500 or so members who NEVER post.

What I object to is a clannish type of feeling -- a welcoming to the "regulars" and a cold shoulder/ignoring or worse of some posters.  People, I believe, ON THEIR OWN will leave the board if they are ignored IF they came just to upset the board and they are ignored.  OR they will change their mode of behavior.

It takes TWO to tango.  I often wonder why that seems so incredibly hard to understand.

TWO -- not one.

Regards,
Christine

Re: Request for active moderation

To Montalk:

Tom, you got your hands full.  Soon from now you will be making a decision which many NR members are expecting.  I know the decision will not satisfuy everybody for it is impossible to cover all the basis.  I would like to expand on the definition of "cowards".

1. The ones as you defined earlier in your post which I agree with completely
2. The ones that make accusations but fail to provide details (If I knew better I would label it as a Machiavelic tactic) which SednaSphere just joined (I hope it was not intentional)

Re: Request for active moderation

Christine B. wrote:

It takes TWO to tango.  I often wonder why that seems so incredibly hard to understand.

TWO -- not one.

Speaking for myself - I get frustrated knowing that a "trouble maker" will get a reaction.  That to use Montalk's term, if someone Shits on the couch, it is going to get a reaction...which in turn will lead to increasing hostility etc.  I see it happen before it even happens.  It does indeed take TWO to tango.  But if one person begins to dance, it is inevitable that another will follow suit.

I am not convinced that the additional dancers are as equally to blame as the one who initiates it all.  Yes, I agree if no one reacted there wouldn't be a problem.  But that's not the way things work - and any trouble maker, especially the more sneaky ones, are well aware of that.

55 (edited by montalk 2005-10-11 15:47:44)

Re: Request for active moderation

Christine wrote:

It takes TWO to tango.  I often wonder why that seems so incredibly hard to understand.

Because negative emotions override understanding, especially when coupled with pre-programming and engineered provocations. Why is it that moon periods tend to favor such episodes, as do critical points on the biorhythm chart? Because those are weak points when judgments are off, biases are high, and anything wanting to exploit the weakness of individuals and groups would therefore have an easier time doing so.

You can control yourself, but can others control themselves also? As I said before, there are good natured people who might have bad days, and ill intentioned people who have good days when their intentions manifest. The latter always come to tango when the first are too intoxicated to resist. The only way to achieve high level harmony is through a closed forum where the varied soul frequencies all resonate to the same keynote. I am not suggesting this, but rather saying that maintaining harmony in an open forum would require some level of pruning.

Christine wrote:

What I object to is a clannish type of feeling -- a welcoming to the "regulars" and a cold shoulder/ignoring or worse of some posters.  People, I believe, ON THEIR OWN will leave the board if they are ignored IF they came just to upset the board and they are ignored.  OR they will change their mode of behavior.

Clannish...well, people try to welcome all new members, keeping an open mind and waiting for their true colors to shine before assessing the degree of mutual resonance and level of interest in further interaction. Over time this naturally causes people to move into different clusters depending on their fundamental soul vibration, their emotional learning path, their attitude and perceptions. Some could see this as clannish, but I think it's more about people of common views lending mutual support.

As for the troublemakers, if they arrive with negative intentions, then their behavior changes only in the mode of manipulation, from abrasive to charming or vice versa. You've seen it before, you'll see it again. The reason that ignoring them is not enough, is that there will always be someone who naively supports a charming troll longer than others have the patience to suffer. This means that if the charm is successful, the good natured posters will be run out of town. It's classic, and it works every time. The method is systematic and replicable.

One of the lessons of 3D/4D is to be compassionate yet wise, and there are many who give themselves over to manipulation and predation in the name of compassion until they get burned badly enough to learn to discern - the only problem is that unless they are hermits, the consequences adversely affect others. Take a mother who cycles through abusive boyfriends until learning to stay away from the charming badboys, she learns her lesson but now her children are screwed up for life. This happens to a milder extent on this forum, as this nexus of interaction provides avenues for individual learning lessons to manifest, including the one about compassion + wisdom. This results in others having to suffer the naive -- maybe their lesson then is patience and tolerance...or maybe their lesson is to speak up despite opposition.

If tensions are already taught, then I am curious to see what happens in the next seven days.

Acquiring fringe knowledge is like digging for diamonds in a mine field.

56 (edited by SednaSphere 2005-10-11 15:53:51)

Re: Request for active moderation

I agree about the clannishness, but that, to me, is not the same as endless game playing for the sole purpose of disruption and distraction, and can lead to abductions, for example, and other things which people here seek to lessen. There are things that really concern me,directly, and some of these involve behind the scenes actions and activities that go beyond discussion. The kind of thing I am talking about is clandestine machinations by individuals and groups designed to elicite responses which can lead to sabotage, and worse. For those abductees, MILABS people and others,
arguments and problems on the board are symptoms, small patterns of disturbance on the water, under which may lie great beasts. Personal disagreements, human drama, are often ephemera, but occasionally
indicators of something inhuman. The rest, for me, is triviality, and forgotten.

whywhywhy: some have thought of me as Machiavellian, it's true. I don't deny that a part of myself overreacted. But no, my intent is not
to play games, especially not now. Have you checked out some of the
past threads where Lyra points out all the stuff that is dealt with behind the scenes?

Christine: you're right, I wasn't specific enouph. But please, you ought to know it wasn't you I was talking about. Montalk already listed the posters and the scenarios around them. So...yes. It was probably wrong of me to "react", but I've got a right to be wrong!

Now, let me see, where did I put that Machiavelli book....?

57 (edited by Christine B. 2005-10-11 16:04:26)

Re: Request for active moderation

Montalk said "The only way to achieve high level harmony is through a closed forum where the varied soul frequencies all resonate to the same keynote."

Gleep --- how could I forget the painfully obvious!!  Thanks.

SednaSphere -- thanks for the clarity.  The stuff that goes on behind the scenes I know nothing about -- and to be honest "disruption and distraction leading to abduction" is honestly beyond my point of reference but certainly could happen. So, I can understand now your concern.

Warmly,
Christine

Re: Request for active moderation

SednaSphere wrote:

whywhywhy: some have thought of me as Machiavellian, it's true. I don't deny that a part of myself overreacted. But no, my intent is not
to play games, especially not now. Have you checked out some of the
past threads where Lyra points out all the stuff that is dealt with behind the scenes?

SednaSphere,
I joined NR days ago or so and at first things were going well.  I did noticed a few encounters here and there which I considered normal but things kept growing.  Yes, I have read Lyra's posts and I understand the situation (well, as good as I can with the limited information I've been able to gathered).  I got involved in some of those threads on which energy was involved and lost my temper a few times.  I like Tom's idea about creating a new "Battle Section"......Let them duke it out in there.  By the time they come out of that thread they will be ready to reason...........NOT!  Tom sounds like a wise individual and he will make the right decision. 

SednaSphere wrote:

Now, let me see, where did I put that Machiavelli book....?

Look up to your left in the bookshelve.................................Just kidding SednaSphere

Re: Request for active moderation

I don't know, I'm just not getting the whole clannishness thing.  I don't see that.  I don't see people getting purposely ignored in a snooty "I'm snubbing you" way.   It's quite the contrary.  Here, despite the volume of threads and posts, it still has a nice snug community feel, meaning, it's not loud and chaotic.   You don't get lost in the shuffle here.   People *see* you here.    To use the Icke forum as an example, yet again, over there there's thousands of members, and tens of thousands of posts already.   You can't keep up.  So much noise and pollution;  unless you make your presense KNOWN by posting in every other thread on a regular basis, you will drown in the crowd.   Here, it's like talking in a large livingroom, versus shouting in a crowded auditorium, or ampitheater, in the case of the Icke forum. 

I think that the idea of "clans" is a misperception, based on a wounded ego.   Sensitive people will take it majorly to heart if their every post isn't responded to be many people.  Those with a thick skin won't even notice or care.  Somewhere in the middle are those that occasionally wonder, "Huh...I wonder if they don't like what I said...?  Maybe that's why nobody responded....?  Oh well!  <shrug> "  Where one falls on the spectrum/scale depends on how sensitive they are;  how thick or thin their skin is, how easily wounded their ego can get.   So is it really a case of there being "clans" here at NR?   Or are the people who feel that way just very sensitive?   

I said this before to Cipher, back when she was all upset, saying she was going to leave, because in her mind, she wasn't getting the level of reaction to her posts that she had anticipated.  She swore she was being ignored / snubbed.  Not accepted.  Getting the cold shoulder.   In truth, many of us had read her posts, really liked them, and just simply had nothing good to add!   Her posts stood alone.   To post after them would be to take away from the power of her post.

I know that I've purposely held off on responding to quite a few posts that I really dug;  not to snub the person, but to make sure others saw their post, because it was just that good.  I didn't want to "drown it out" and take away from it.

This whole "clan" thing was mentioned before, and honestly, as somebody who's participated in other messageboards, and has really SEEN true "board cliques", I can tell you, that's not happening here.   Sure, it's my subjective opinion, but I can say it with conviction only because when pressed to try to figure out who's supposedly "in" with the whatever supposed "clan", I couldn't tell you.  I can't group anybody here together in that way.   I don't know, that's just how I see it I guess.

"Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "Holy shit ... what a ride!"  - Anonymous
-----
"I get by with a little help from my (higher density) friends."
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Re: Request for active moderation

Sorry for the bathroom metaphors, this will be my last one...

Regarding the "Free For All" at first I was thinking that if there's a bathroom, no one will be going on the couches.  But then after considering what others have opined, I realized that a bathroom in an open house invites an even less desirable stream of traffic. We would have the craziest "bums" trotting mud through the livingroom just to use the bathroom. The original discussion concerning the Battle Arena pretty much settles the question.

Also, there are plenty of other forums like godlikeproductions.com for that kind of stuff, so let's keep the integrity or NR uniformly intact and "flush" the Free for All concept. We don't have to be everything for everyone, and I'm reminded of pleasing none by trying to please all.

[to whywhywhy and all newer members: tension on this board happens cyclically, and it passes everytime. So don't get stressed out or turned off, it's no different from the weather. Today it was cloudy outside but I know it will be sunny again.]

Acquiring fringe knowledge is like digging for diamonds in a mine field.