16 Reply by google (edited by google 2005-12-13 09:51:03)

  • Registered: 2005-12-01

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

lyra wrote:
google wrote:

I'm well award of how the monetary system works.

Well to be honest, I wasn't seeing that in your post.  It seemed, based on what you wrote, that you weren't sure about it all, using words like "probably" and admitting that these are subjects you know just a little bit about, and concluding that adults should be allowed to enter into binding contracts, as if that was the heart of the issue, rather than the nature of money itself.  So anyway, miscommunication I guess.



google wrote:

Why is it fraud if the nature of the monetary system is common knowledge ?


With the exception of paying tax, nobody is forcing me to use it.

I enter into a contract with the bank, voluntarily, without the use of force or fraud.

How is this a scam ?

I defend the right of people to enter into binding contracts.

All good points.  It boils down to word usage then.  The nature of money is a joke, but is it technically "fraud" or a "scam" when the information is out there?   I guess not.  So maybe it's all about finding a better word than fraud or scam to sum up the deception that's taking place here.

Because admit it, there is a form of deception happening....but yet again, the information is out there.   

The deception occurs through "lying by ommision."  When our schools, and system in general don't tell us the full story when we're growing up so that we'll fully comprehend what the deal is.   Knowledge is a two way street, ultimately, and we're equally responsible for educating ourselves as they are responsible for telling us about the system they've set up for us.

But they don't disclose all the details, and we in turn don't bother to learn.   We don't care.  And by the time we do care, it's possibly too late.  That's our own fault, not theirs.   But let's admit it, it would be nice if they would've told us.....and more importantly, given us other options.  So yes, I get now what you were saying about the monopoly thing, and you're right.

The kicker is, what would happen if we all tried to implement a bartering system, something where goods were exchanged for something of equal worth?  Ha!  They'd never have it.  Or how about getting rid of the Federal Reserve, and getting us back on the gold/silver standard?  Ha!  Right, that's the stuff of assasinations.   So yeah, you're right about that.

Yeah, sometimes I word things ackwardly.

Sorry about that and I understand why you are passionate about the 'people' who are manipulating us.

So am I.

I wish everybody was.


They would never expose the Federal Reserve problem in a publically funded school. 

It took all these years to dumb us down in the first place.








I could take the problem of the financial health of the USA up a notch but I don't want to hijack the thread any more than I already have.


Are you familiar with the Montana Freeman ?

http://www.freedomdomain.com/freemen.html

google's Website

17 Reply by Jen (edited by Jen 2005-12-13 10:21:36)

  • Jen
  • Guest

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Thanks for sharing that article Aya, good stuff.  Here's another one I like on this subject:
http://www.nibiruancouncil.com/html/9dm … ctive.html

excerpt:

In this course of Service to Self/Service to Others, there is one prevailing belief system. This belief system is “if it is spiritual, it should be free."  In this class one must learn the error of this belief system by experiencing the near total disempowerment it creates in one’s life.  To graduate from this class and the reality it creates, one must reach the following conclusions:

a. The only thing that is free is nothing–a “no-thing."   A “no-thing" is something that doesn’t exist.  If it is something (and in the context of this missive, spiritual knowledge) then it has a value.  And anything that has a value is always offered as part of an energy exchange or barter (to use an earth term, bartered).  A something in the higher realms is never given for free because that would relegate it to the level of a no-thing thereby destroying its right to exist in its present form. It would return to the Universal Fund (discussed later in this missive) as raw energy.

b. When we adhere to the imbalances in this belief system and believe that spiritual knowledge, or any other knowledge for that matter, should be free, then the universe has no choice other than to support us in this belief system by blocking bartering energy (money) from coming to us, thus remaining in alignment with our current belief system.  The Universe is governed by a law that states that it can only give us those things we believe we need. And since we have already stated that we don’t believe we need money in order to obtain the spiritual knowledge of the Universe, the universe complies with our belief and shuts down our ability to manifest money for those things we say should not require money.

Within a short time after embracing this belief system we find that our ability to manifest money dries up because we believe we don’t need it to acquire spiritual things.  This is why so many on the spiritual path are experiencing an ever-diminishing ability to manifest money; they still adhere to this belief system.

But, the answer is not necessarily that we ought to charge for our services, or to be concerned about payment in the 3D manner...

  • From: U.K
  • Registered: 2005-12-11

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Hi all,

as I have mentioned on other forums, why wallow in poverty? living a poor and humble life does NOT make you more spiritual than a god damned millionaire.

I personally use this 3D illusion to my benefit. I have fast cars and money but I know they are only material things of no importance. David Icke has been on the breadline and so have I. You create what you want in life. If you want to live in a council house for the rest of your life etc, have loads of kids at a young age etc, then do so.

David Icke has given his all, I think he deserves a bit of illusory coin to make his stay a bit easier.

Enlightenment is the process of facing yourself.

Balance=Freedom
  • From: NOTHING
  • Registered: 2004-09-03

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

google wrote:

Fractional reserve banking is a known scam that people knowingly buy into.

smile At first I was like, "That's not true - If people knew, they wouldn't do it."  But then he does have a point. Because I bet that a large portion of the poeple I was referring to would probably still do it anyway . . if only to maintain those small perks (only reasons why they may have began a checking account in the first place) like free check cashing, direct deposit and/or debit card.

Oh, I sound like a spokesperson. big_smile

I do still maintain that a majority of Americans do not understand fractional reserve banking.

I am as is Void.

20 Reply by morningsun76 (edited by morningsun76 2005-12-13 17:32:24)

  • morningsun76
  • morningsun76
  • the answer has been with you the whole time
  • Offline
  • From: In two worlds
  • Registered: 2004-09-10

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Ayahuasca wrote:

So I'm afraid I have to disagree with your golden rule in a big way. Here's a good article I once found on the subject of spirituality and money:

Good article.

google wrote:

I'm well award of how the monetary system works ... Why is it fraud if the nature of the monetary system is common knowledge ?  ...  With the exception of paying tax, nobody is forcing me to use it.

Awareness is really just a part of the question.  The bottom line here is that it's a government-sanctioned monopoly on the issuance of currency.  There's no choice on your part involved.   When you apply for a loan or do any other kind of banking, and sign a contract accepting their terms, it's not because you chose their service out of many in a free-market scenario.  All banks are part of the same system, and you only dealt with them at ALL because there is no other choice, government (force) made sure of that.    But you still have to live, and eat ... so does that mean you go live in a cave instead of contract with the system?   No, you do what you have to do to survive.  You recognize that it's not voluntary, you're not dealing with another honest human being in a face-to-face agreement.  You're dealing with an entire system designed to fleece you for everything you've got.

Here's an analogy: you've been unjustly imprisoned for a life term, for a crime you didn't commit.  You also know that, despite your innocence, there is no realistic chance you'll ever be able to prove it and get yourself out.   So, after about ten years you become eligible for parole, and in order to apply you have to sign papers that include a statement that you accept the validity of the charges.   What do you do?     Refuse to apply for parole -- and spend the rest of your life in prison -- because you won't admit to being guilty of something you didn't do?   You COULD do that,  and preserve your integrity 100%.    Or, recognizing the totality of the circumstances, you take practical advantage of whatever openings you can find in their system, and apply for the parole, since you might just get out tomorrow.  You recognize that they have you under compulsion, so you do anything you can that might free yourself from their clutches.

In the case of the monetary system, you use it because practically speaking you HAVE to.  One day if everyone else "wakes up" and realistic alternatives become available, THEN maybe there will be a true "choice" involved.    In the meantime, the only choice is between living your life as a human being, or like an animal on the street.

Check out the video "The Money Masters: How International Bankers Control America."  One interesting point it brings out, that I hadn't considered before, is that having BACKING (such as gold) for currency is NOT necessarily a good thing in and of itself.    If there is no gold in the country -- ie, foreign powers control the gold (which is actually the case) -- then a gold standard could actually be very harmful.   A well-rationed fiat (backed by nothing) currency could serve the people far better, if it be well- and honestly-managed.   

That reminds me of the scene in The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy where the Golgafrinchans decided to adopt the leaf as their unit of currency, which led to an exchange rate of "two deciduous forests buying one ship's peanut."   So to "combat inflation" they decided to burn down all the forests. smile

  • czyx
  • czyx
  • Sparking the gap.
  • Offline
  • From: Denver, CO
  • Registered: 2004-09-11

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Martin Gman wrote:

as I have mentioned on other forums, why wallow in poverty?

Why does it have to be "wallowing"? Plenty of people are just fine with being poor, because they have little need for money. They aren't all dirty, miserable, and hungry as you imply. Aboriginals have no money. Traditional hunter-gatherers have no money. Members of most tribal cultures have no money. You're here today because of those people: your distant ancestors. People lived without money for a lot longer than they have been living with money. On the timeline of human existence, money-based living is a tiny speck appearing only at the very end. Even today, in the midst of our civilized, money-based culture, Freegans get by just fine. In the (probably near) future, sustainable horticulture and bartering is going to be the way to go--and people are going to find it a lot more fulfilling than investment banking or website design which fills up their wallets but not their souls. Having no money does not automatically mean poverty. Poverty is a state of deficiency which can be applied to such things as the nutritive properties of the soil or the moral properties of the soul. One can be technically poor, with very little money, yet without experiencing this slightest poverty in diet, shelter, human contact, wisdom, spirit, or soul-substance.

Martin Gman wrote:

living a poor and humble life does NOT make you more spiritual than a god damned millionaire.

Yes, living a humble life does make you more spiritual than a millionaire. Living a humble life is called walking the walk. Being truly humble isn't just an attitude, it's an orientation and a real-world practice. Money is dirty. It doesn't have to be, but it is--because of the cultural system it is connected with. Money is the lifeblood of our culture of repression and exploitation. By having much more of it than others you are setting yourself above the poor in a very real way, no matter how humble you think you are. It is impossible to become a millionaire without amassing more money than you really need, at the expense of others. You can affect a humble attitude, but you can't escape the fact that your wealth means someone else's slavery. Fast cars don't grow on trees. They're only possible in a system where the poor are exploited. If it wasn't for the army of working poor at the bottom of the pyramid--who flip burgers, clean toilets, pick fruit, and make shoes--your fast car wouldn't be possible. If the poor all at once decided to become rich by the same means you employed (hard work and dedication, no doubt) the system would be unable to deal with their vacancy from the lower levels of the pyramid. A void would be left which would have to be filled. Some other group would have to become poor in order for today's poor to become rich. This is the way of the civilized world.

Every good spiritual tradition warns against greed. Every healthy culture has fables about the self-destruction of the greedy. If you want to be told that greed is fine, you're going to have to watch Wall Street, go to an Amway presentation, or watch Creflo Dollar or Benny Hinn. No legitimate source of wisdom is going to tell you what you want to hear.

Martin Gman wrote:

I personally use this 3D illusion to my benefit. I have fast cars and money but I know they are only material things of no importance. David Icke has been on the breadline and so have I.

To quote Matthew 16:26, "For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?" The only way to sustain your illusion is by imagining that nothing is connected and that you're floating in a perfect bubble where material things have no meaning or consequence.

Martin Gman wrote:

If you want to live in a council house for the rest of your life etc, have loads of kids at a young age etc, then do so.

Right. Blame the poor. They want to be that way. All of them want to be that way. And all of them are that way! That's what being poor means! roll

Martin Gman wrote:

You create what you want in life.

Here is the folly and horror of the "You Create Your Own Reality" paradigm. It's an easy way to brush off responsibility to your fellow man. I am reminded of the Hindu caste system, which grew out of the same occult lore that the Nazis found so very inspirational.

Martin Gman wrote:

David Icke has given his all, I think he deserves a bit of illusory coin to make his stay a bit easier.

You mean more comfortable. Knowing and sharing in the truth makes life easier. The truth energizes and strengthens a person, allowing them to more easily overcome the hurdles of reality and thereby achieve growth. Having more money allows one to more comfortably avoid or minimize these hurdles.

--Justin

22 Reply by Jen (edited by Jen 2005-12-13 18:36:02)

  • Jen
  • Guest

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Well, for my part, I am not especially interested in amassing huge amounts of money, but I don't see the rich as being necessarily less spiritual.  I do agree the system sucks, and it has to change,  but I still feel that anyone can create what they desire, including a comfortable and abundant life even within this corrupt system, if they are in touch with that desire and have faith in their abiity to fulfill it.

There is enough for everyone, abundance is our natural state. It's our collective belief in lack that keeps us in it--and that fosters the assumption that if one person is rich, others have to be poor.

  • Registered: 2005-12-01

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

morningsun76 wrote:
Ayahuasca wrote:

So I'm afraid I have to disagree with your golden rule in a big way. Here's a good article I once found on the subject of spirituality and money:

Good article.

google wrote:

I'm well award of how the monetary system works ... Why is it fraud if the nature of the monetary system is common knowledge ?  ...  With the exception of paying tax, nobody is forcing me to use it.

Awareness is really just a part of the question.  The bottom line here is that it's a government-sanctioned monopoly on the issuance of currency.  There's no choice on your part involved.   When you apply for a loan or do any other kind of banking, and sign a contract accepting their terms, it's not because you chose their service out of many in a free-market scenario.  All banks are part of the same system, and you only dealt with them at ALL because there is no other choice, government (force) made sure of that.    But you still have to live, and eat ... so does that mean you go live in a cave instead of contract with the system?   No, you do what you have to do to survive.  You recognize that it's not voluntary, you're not dealing with another honest human being in a face-to-face agreement.  You're dealing with an entire system designed to fleece you for everything you've got.

......

In the case of the monetary system, you use it because practically speaking you HAVE to.  One day if everyone else "wakes up" and realistic alternatives become available, THEN maybe there will be a true "choice" involved.    In the meantime, the only choice is between living your life as a human being, or like an animal on the street.

Check out the video "The Money Masters: How International Bankers Control America."  One interesting point it brings out, that I hadn't considered before, is that having BACKING (such as gold) for currency is NOT necessarily a good thing in and of itself.    If there is no gold in the country -- ie, foreign powers control the gold (which is actually the case) -- then a gold standard could actually be very harmful.   A well-rationed fiat (backed by nothing) currency could serve the people far better, if it be well- and honestly-managed.   

......

Yeah, that's a great video and I agree with you that we are, for all practical reasons, forced to use the system's money but we could support politicians that want change.

I don't want to sound like a campaigner but the Libertarian Party of America would set up a government issued competing, silver based,  currency called the Liberty dollar. At that point, if we wanted, we could create one Federal Reserve note worth 7.5 trillion dollars and give it to the international bankers as payment for the national debt.

That would be cool.

The Brotherhood would do anything to prevent this.

People don't want to be bogged down with trying to understanding the complications of the monetary system, they understandably, just want  to live their lives. The problem is that the controllers of the banking system can cause a depression anytime they want by calling in loans and not issuing any new ones. At that point real assets will be exchanged for the worthless Federal Reserve notes and I think that is what David Icke is really talking about.

.... and he is right.

We are being manipulated



I used to think that education and politics were the solution to our problems but now I think the solution is spiritual growth. What's the point of changing the system if greed and corruption will just creep in again ?

That's why I like this website.
People here realise that the way to change things is to change ourselves first.

google's Website

  • From: U.K
  • Registered: 2005-12-11

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Hi,

CZYX

Yes, living a humble life does make you more spiritual than a millionaire. Living a humble life is called walking the walk. Being truly humble isn't just an attitude, it's an orientation and a real-world practice.

You dont get it do you. From the minute we are born we are slaves to the system. No matter where on earth you reside you are a slave. I detest this system but I know I cant beat it physically, but multidimensionally I can.

I hope you are happy living like an animal but I choose not to. I dont believe in God so I cant be humble. Nothing in this world can humble me and I will use the 3D reality to my full advantage, afterall it has been using me for thousands of years.

Enlightenment is the process of facing yourself.

Balance=Freedom
  • Registered: 2005-06-26

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Imprisoned Consciousness is the only real problem, not physicality/materiality. In case you haven't noticed, physicality is transient. Consciousness is not. "The system" is not physicality-based. "The system" is consciousness programming. This confusion seems pretty apparent in your posts.

If this isn't understood and you find yourself at some point in a variable physicality (higher density consciousness)... you'll still be quite imprisoned. Freeing your consciousness is possible right here, right now. Choosing not to see that is a choice. So it seems your free will is intact, and it's just your use of it that's at issue. Thus, a sense of being a slave.

"The most important decision you have to make is whether you live in a hostile or friendly universe."
~ Albert Einstein

The real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking new landscapes, but in having new eyes. ~Marcel Proust

The evolution of humanity is an evolution of the heart. The path is through the heart.

26 Reply by Jen

  • Jen
  • Guest

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Sowelu wrote:

Imprisoned Consciousness is the only real problem, not physicality/materiality. In case you haven't noticed, physicality is transient. Consciousness is not. "The system" is not physicality-based. "The system" is consciousness programming. This confusion seems pretty apparent in your posts.

If this isn't understood and you find yourself at some point in a variable physicality (higher density consciousness)... you'll still be quite imprisoned. Freeing your consciousness is possible right here, right now. Choosing not to see that is a choice. So it seems your free will is intact, and it's just your use of it that's at issue. Thus, a sense of being a slave.

From my post, Question Reality, quoting Tobias, in Spirituality and Metaphysics:

Question your own reality. Question how you fit into all this.
Question, "Does this reality serve me?" Don't question whether it's
good or bad. Does it serve you, Shaumbra? If you feel you're limited
because you don't have an education, it's a reality and a food that
you're using to feed you. Does it serve you anymore? Or, is it like
last week's clothing styles? Does it serve you? If it doesn't,
question it. Why are you there? That tends to start breaking it down.

Questioning reality will cause it to break down the way it was molded,
break back down into the original energy form, so now you can create
new consciousness. So, what do you want consciousness to be in your
life? Well, that is up to you. That is up to you.

Again, remember consciousness isn't from the mind. It's the deep
soulful part of yourself. It's based much on experiences from the past
that have created your level of belief and consciousness. And, it can
be changed at any moment. if you truly believe it. if you truly let it
be very flexible and very open. Question belief, and it begins to change.

Now, as it changes, two interesting things happen. As your
consciousness changes, your reality starts changing also. [...]

  • From: U.K
  • Registered: 2005-12-11

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Sowelu,

You know nothing about me or my background. Reading materials like Matrix V and Monroe will not free you.

Anything which vibrates in this 'Illusory' universe and less dense higher dimensions are a part of this enslavement agenda.

I walk the path of 'Balance' by merging the negative aspects of mankind with the positive. My life is then one of Balance.

Enlightenment is the process of facing yourself.

Balance=Freedom

28 Reply by hsh

  • hsh
  • hsh
  • Transdimensional Traveler
  • Offline
  • From: Arizona
  • Registered: 2005-12-02

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Martin Gman wrote:

Hi,
You dont get it do you. From the minute we are born we are slaves to the system. No matter where on earth you reside you are a slave.

This is correct. Beginning at birth, and possible in the womb as well, we are already being socially conditioned. This holds true even for the ones raised by wolves. smile We aren't free because all we're doing is basically running second-hand programs, unoriginal belief systems. None of these things defines us. There is no absolute truth in this dimension. There cannot be. Everything at one level or another is a truth, a lie, or both.

A good practice I found is to sit down at the end of the day and review everything you said and did, write it down, and then begin tracing the origin or belief related to those actions. The result is scary. I almost had a nervous breakdown when I realized almost nothing I do is based on free-will, but previous programming. Don't believe me? Give it a try. There it is, who you are, constructed from parents, religions, media, opinions, books, TV, etc.

The closest I've come to the truth is when I sit still, empty all thoughts, and not label anything; just experience. I ask myself what the significance of my immediate environment is, something I learned from reading Krishnamurti, which is again another idea from "outside", but some outside programs are better than others. big_smile

namaste,
sakash

hsh's Website

  • From: Zion
  • Registered: 2004-09-28

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Martin Gman wrote:

You know nothing about me or my background. Reading materials like Matrix V and Monroe will not free you.

Where did that come from? Sowelu never mentioned anything about Matrix 5 or Monroe, and neither has anyone else on this thread.

Martin Gman wrote:

Anything which vibrates in this 'Illusory' universe and less dense higher dimensions are a part of this enslavement agenda.

But that isn't you talking now, is it? That sounds more like David Icke talking through you than anything else. I have no time for people who merely parrot this very ill-thought out version of reality. If you think that you're merely a prisoner here in this place then do us all a favor: kill yourself. Seriously. If you're just a slave in this place, then shouldn't you be looking to break the bonds of incarnation and getting out of here as soon as possible?

Martin Gman wrote:

I walk the path of 'Balance' by merging the negative aspects of mankind with the positive. My life is then one of Balance.

Think again. From your comments above you make it perfectly clear that your path is anything but balanced.

"Fear is the great barrier to human growth. Unknowns create fears. When these Unknowns become Knowns the fears diminish and disappear, and we are able to cope with whatever confronts us." - Robert A. Monroe

30 Reply by Martin Gman (edited by Martin Gman 2005-12-16 11:44:32)

  • From: U.K
  • Registered: 2005-12-11

Re: an open letter to Neomatrix

Neomatrix

But that isn't you talking now, is it? That sounds more like David Icke talking through you than anything else. I have no time for people who merely parrot this very ill-thought out version of reality. If you think that you're merely a prisoner here in this place then do us all a favor: kill yourself. Seriously. If you're just a slave in this place, then shouldn't you be looking to break the bonds of incarnation and getting out of here as soon as possible?

I have been an Astral projector for 15 years. I was extremely happy when Icke came close to what I have been saying for many years.

Think again. From your comments above you make it perfectly clear that your path is anything but balanced.

Hmmm let me think about this one.

Enlightenment is the process of facing yourself.

Balance=Freedom