• Registered: 2005-12-02

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

Neomatrix wrote:

Dear Mr. Icke,

It is with deep regret that I am writing to inform you that I will no longer be visiting your website, purchasing your books, or in any other way supporting your work. A time of choice is now at hand for me, and already I have decided in which direction I will be travelling. Allow me to explain, if you will:

I have been visiting your website now for the last five years or more, and I will readily admit that the information therein served its purpose in helping to awaken my programmed, indoctrinated mind to the reality of life upon this planet. Thanks to you, the visible selfishness of my own species finally began to make sense as I realized how we are all being manipulated by a heirarchical system of control that is entirely callous and utterly inhuman.

And so, for a good many years I enjoyed filling my brain with all manner of conspiracy facts and theories. It felt good to dismiss the responsibility for my species' rapid deconstruction of every natural ecosystem on Earth by passing it off onto a race of evil Reptilian/Alien overlords. It is their fault that we were all acting this way, you said; it is their fault that we are here endlessly fighting against one another, because that is how they maintain their control.

It made a lot of sense to me for a time, and as your group of 'followers' grew from just a few thousand worldwide a decade ago to the millions who actively support your work now, I almost begun to have hope that things around here might just change for the better. I almost thought that, because of you and others like you disseminating this information, that people would finally wake up.

But who was I kidding?

I now find myself at a point where I am completely disillusioned with all of this New Age love and light bullshit, and endless conspiracy crap. The followers of the Cult of Icke, as I shall call it for want of a better name, are no more enlightened than the followers of any other religious or political belief system you care to name. They are merely sheep who have moved out of one pen and straight into another, whilst believing themselves to have been set free.

There is a difference you see, between talking the talk, and walking the walk. And I'm sorry to say it Mr. Icke, but all I've seen you and your followers doing so far is a whole lot of talking. Your lips might be moving, as they often are for hours on end, but your feet are still stuck firmly to the ground.

Do you know why this has happened? You don't? Then I'll tell you. As much as it pains me to say it Mr. Icke, your conspiratorial worldview has now become quite fashionably mainstream. It's now even considered quite trendy to talk about the Illuminati, and the New World Order, and the matrix, and even other dimensions of conscious experience. No longer weird and abnormal is this; it's now become the hallmark of those who consider themselves 'enlightened' and 'in the know'.

And whilst some would say that knowledge is power, I'm here to tell you that this is absolute bullshit. I'm almost sorry to say this Mr. Icke, but knowledge - of and by itself - means absolutely f*ck all: it is nothing more than an intellectual wankfest. So whilst you continue to pump out one oversized book after another, each one endlessly repeating numerous facts and figures about who engaged in what conspiracy and when, and whilst your growing and fanatically loyal readership enjoys soaking this up in the misguided belief that they are becoming more and more 'enlightened' with every turn of the page, you might just fail to notice that things down here aren't actually getting any better.

The sheep are all still asleep, you see. They may now be better read, better educated, more informed sheep - but that's all. They may be able to tell you the names of all thirteen families that compose the Illuminati; they may be able to take apart the official story of 9/11 piece-by-piece; they may even know a thing or two about quantum physics, non-locality, the Kaluza-Klein theory, and David Bohm's holographic principle.

The problem is that no one is really demonstrating their understanding of this information in the manner that they choose to live within their daily lives. They are simply paying lip service to truths that they are not yet ready to understand and integrate; they are still living and thinking within the same old mental boxes that they did before you and your Reptilians came along. It's quite one thing to say, "this reality I live within is an illusion," but it's a different thing entirely to demonstrate your understanding of this in your daily words and actions and interactions with other people.

You see, they are all still buying into the illusion, Mr. Icke. They are all still taking it so very, very seriously indeed. They are all still speaking out against people, events, and situations that do not conform to the expected 'norms' of our sickening society. They are all still playing the game by its rules. Everything is still all life and death, right and wrong, good and evil, black and white to them. They haven't truly learned the value of allowance, of acceptance, of freedom, of uniqueness, and of experience. They are all still too busy struggling to survive and thrive; still fighting to impose petty limitations on other people and on themselves. They are all, for want of a better term, "spiritual wannabes." Smarter, but none the wiser.

They may have listened to you, you see, but they have not yet truly understood.

Just like yourself, Mr. Icke. You are the most gifted person on this planet when it comes to talking the talk. I know, because I've personally seen you do it for hours upon hours on more than one occasion. But when it comes to walking the walk however, you often fall flat on your face. Take - for example - your recent e-mail to those people, like myself, who were subscribed to your newsletter, wherein which you whined on and on about not getting anything in return for your efforts, then threatening to stop completely if people don't start appreciating you quick-smart!

And yet how many times in your books and speaking events do you wax lyrical about the value of self-sacrifice; about giving without the expectation of receiving something in return? You're sending mixed messages to your audience, you see. No wonder the poor buggers are all confused - not that I'm trying to excuse their behavior or pass off the responsibility for their actions onto your good self. I wouldn't do that to you, no matter how frustrated I might be.

So I'm sorry for my tone here, really I am; but I'm increasingly tired of the bullshit. I'm tired of people dabbling into materials that they are clearly not yet ready to comprehend. At least, not without a major shift in perspective. You've basically gone and done what Microsoft did with the computing world: you've taken something that is normally quite complex, that requires a modicum of intelligence and competence to understand correctly, and dumbed it down just enough to make it palatable and understandable to an audience that otherwise wouldn't get it. And now we are paying witness to the inevitably similar end result.

It is for this reason that I can no longer support yourself or your work. Although you may - perhaps - have the best of intentions, your methods leave much to be desired. You've done much to help inform, but very little so far to help transform. It hardly matters whether or not there is a race of nasty Reptilians controlling our financial, educational, political, media and healthcare systems. It isn't the bloody Reptilians that are the real problem down here - it's us; and as long as yourself and others keep endlessly spouting on about how nasty these lizard folks are you're simply distracting the real human beings on this planet from actually taking responsibility for themselves, and making a positive change. Knowingly or not, you're only engaging in further promoting victim mentality, thus disempowering people even more, and keeping them locked within a false cage of self-imposed experiential limitation.

So, here's a thought. How about this for your next book: You don't mention the frigging Illuminati. You don't mention the Reptilians. You don't talk about the matrix. No history lessons about how the bloodlines moved from Sumeria and Egypt, into Rome, then England, and finally across to America. You don't make so much as a passing comment about September 11th. And no more jokes about how stupid President Bush is (talk about stating the obvious!) If you could instead offer something truly unique, something that has the potential to really wake people up - not just to the global fascist agenda, but to themselves and their own programmed behavior - then I'll be on your side once again.

Until then, it's goodbye from me.

Jason.

Rather than spending time pointlessly putting him down for not making up some extra bullshit to keep people entertained when he would rather keep pumping the VITAL truth out to people, how's about you go to a BBC forum or another main stream forum and wright an "Open Letter" to people who have no idea of what amazing information and inspiration his books have??..... if you don't want to read them any more then don't!, I have not heard that he has a hit squad that he sends out to people who stop reading his stuff.  I think it will be very healthy for others to read his books and if he writes another 50 books with the same vibe each and everyone of those books will be Great in my eyes, and doing a great job.

I don't think he claims to be a magician or an entertainer.... he just wants to get some info out there which is a extremely hard task.

32 Reply by Neomatrix (edited by Neomatrix 2005-12-02 20:22:01)

  • From: Zion
  • Registered: 2004-09-28

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

Another wonderful post, Marcus. Much respect to you. I don't necessarily need to see a spiritual revolution occur within my own lifetime, but it would at least be nice to get a glimpse of some insipient awakening within people as a result of the massive exposure that they've had to all of this very eye-opening material. But what I feel has unfortunately happened is that the material itself has become a distraction to the path.

I recognise that there are two perspectives one can take with this: The point of view of a human being, immersed in the drama of it; or the point of view of a spiritual being, safely out of harms way, infinite in being, deathless and immortal. Two very different perspectives, and I do flip-flop between the two, struggling to find a balance. The human being is concerned for his species, and would hate to see our great potential wasted simply because we got too lazy and apathetic to think and take action and stand up for ourselves. The purely spiritual being holds little opinion either way. Whatever happens happens, and things will go on either way, whether human beings are still out there populating the cosmos or not. But what I am, now, is a blending of those two entities. I am not just a spiritual being, and nor am I just a human being. I am, at this moment, both of those things joined together. Does spirit incarnate here merely to observe, or does it come here to help co-create? Does it come to assist in manifesting possibilities for the creation of new patterns of consciousness perhaps not seen anywhere else?

There are indeed a number of problems facing our species right now, many of which we can actively do something about. You listed all of the ones I was thinking about, from the breakdown of our natural ecosystem, to the declaration of a new world order wherein privacy and individual rights would be a thing of the past, and everything we do and say (and think?) would be monitored for acceptability. These are valid concerns to have, from the human perspective, especially if you're thinking of raising a family at this time. With many of these problems there is a deadline, after which making a change will be so much harder to do. Perhaps our species has now become so lazy, so pacified by material comforts, that this is the only eventuality that will now wake it from its deep slumber.

Certainly one doesn't have to respond with fear to this idea, but what good is there in educating ourselves about these globalists and their agenda if we are not going to use that information constructively? Unless it assists in raising our awareness, so that we can take a more active role in shaping the future of our species, then that future will be decided for us by forces that don't give a shit about your rights, or the rights of your family, your friends, or anyone else for that matter.

You say that such a change can only happen when it is ready. I would amend that slightly to read that such a change can only happen when we are ready. And this is not a passive process. Armchair spirituality won't get us there, anymore than sitting watching television will. We can work upon ourselves, and work upon ourselves some more, but unless we put our knowledge and abilities to good use then our potential to effect change within this world will remain latent. So, why are we struggling to awaken at all? Why are we struggling to raise our level of self-awareness? What's the point?

Perhaps this drive, that obviously you and I - and no doubt many others here on this forum - share, that being an ingrained urge to awaken and become more than we were, is - as you suggest - simply a deep drive within a limited number of us. Does that mean that this drive does not exist within other people whatsoever? Or is it simply the case that this drive has been lost beneath layers and layers of social and cultural programming? I must admit that I honestly have no idea, although it would be interesting to find out.

I agree completely that it isn't our place to awaken others; that they must do this for themselves. The question then becomes one of whether to at least give them a solid push? Must we really descend into a global totalitarian police state, or destroy the delicate balance of the natural ecosystems that work to support life on this planet, before the alarm bell really starts going off in the heads of these folks? Do most people walking around on this rock really have their heads planted so firmly up their asses that they think some magical solution is going to present itself when things are at their worst?

Okay, I appreciate that certain religious folks do indeed expect a messiah figure to descend from the sky and fix everything that we've destroyed in our ignorance. But for rest of us, who either don't hold to this belief or who recognise it for the bullshit that it is, we have to face the truth of the matter: and that is that we are down here on our own, and will ultimately have to take responsibility for the collective actions of all our peoples, inevitably reaping what we have sown, no matter how horrific or how unpleasant that may be.

And all of this simply because we're too lazy to do otherwise? Is that really the only solution here? Perhaps it is, but that's a very damning statement about the collective maturity (or lack thereof) of the human race.

Maybe I'm wrong about all of this. Maybe there's something I'm overlooking, or some as-yet unknown factor of which I am not aware. But I do feel that we must strive to find a workable balance between the needs of our human selves, and the needs of our divine selves. We shouldn't trade off one for the other. We should never become so involved as to see everything as life or death, but neither should we become so complacent as to shrug our shoulders and let things carry on apace without our involvement. We do indeed create our own reality, but if we abrogate that right then we'll also lose that tremendous power. You're right in saying that it's never too late, so it simply becomes a question of what kind of future we really want to create, and how far into darkness and ignorance we're willing to travel before we turn back to catch a glimpse of a rapidly fading light away in the distance.

"Fear is the great barrier to human growth. Unknowns create fears. When these Unknowns become Knowns the fears diminish and disappear, and we are able to cope with whatever confronts us." - Robert A. Monroe
  • From: Zion
  • Registered: 2004-09-28

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

Third Wave wrote:

Rather than spending time pointlessly putting him down...

No, I definitely had a point. Perhaps you weren't paying close enough attention.

Third Wave wrote:

how's about you go to a BBC forum or another main stream forum and wright an "Open Letter" to people who have no idea of what amazing information and inspiration his books have??

Alrighty, I'll do that, if you can tell me one significant thing his books have inspired you to accomplish.

Third Wave wrote:

I think it will be very healthy for others to read his books and if he writes another 50 books with the same vibe each and everyone of those books will be Great in my eyes, and doing a great job.

If they are still of use to you, then great! I'm not suggesting that you should stop reading them. I'm simply saying that they focus too heavily on problems, whilst offering precious little in the way of solutions.

Third Wave wrote:

I don't think he claims to be a magician or an entertainer.... he just wants to get some info out there which is a extremely hard task.

And I already stated how pleased I am that he is around to do that. But after almost fifteen years of this research, he's still going around in loops with the same old stuff.

"Fear is the great barrier to human growth. Unknowns create fears. When these Unknowns become Knowns the fears diminish and disappear, and we are able to cope with whatever confronts us." - Robert A. Monroe

34 Reply by Human Being

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Re: An open letter to David Icke.

Third Wave wrote:

how's about you go to a BBC forum or another main stream forum and wright an "Open Letter" to people who have no idea of what amazing information and inspiration his books have??

Now that's lateral thinking... or maybe reverse psychology...

I personally think that if someone is getting the "truth" out,
there are a few possiblities (PTB) that one should consider:

(1) they are probably being "allowed" to
(2) they may have "untruths" in their info
(3) they could even be openly cooperating

David Icke isn't 100% right about all his stuff. Is anybody?
There are tons of book writers. Some better than others...

  • Registered: 2005-12-02

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

You probably did read his books but I don't think you grasped his message.  Icke is not some super-human that has the power to transform the world with a snap of fingers.  Icke is just presenting information -- which is NEUTRAL. He incorporates the conspiracy (what some of you people are crying about) and spirituality. Wouldn't Icke be cheating the readers by LEAVING OUT INFORMATION that some crybabies find that its only making it worse?

Why the f*ck should Icke have to do something? He makes it clear that YOUR reality is in YOUR hands, it's up to YOU.... so why are you talking about Icke as if he's some God and his books are law?  I think you need to quit crying about the fact that Icke brings out all this negative information. What the f*ck do you think books on CONSPIRACY expos is going to be about?!?! Bees and butterflies????

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Re: An open letter to David Icke.

Mystery wrote:

What the f*ck do you think books on CONSPIRACY expos is going to be about?!?! Bees and butterflies????

Well, he does talk about the Merovingians and Project Monarch...

Neomatrix has a point, but so do you. Icke has filled a niche, a need, a demand. No one argues with that. And he pulls off the conspiracy talk like no other. The question is, will he continue to spin the same record or go beyond? His latest book cut out the first two hundred pages of the same old conspiracy. That's a change. Who knows what he will put out next. If he were to go in the direction that Neomatrix brought up, that would be cool. Or maybe others will rise to fulfill that demand.

Acquiring fringe knowledge is like digging for diamonds in a mine field.

montalk's Website

37 Reply by Neomatrix (edited by Neomatrix 2005-12-02 21:38:51)

  • From: Zion
  • Registered: 2004-09-28

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

Mystery wrote:

You probably did read his books but I don't think you grasped his message.  Icke is not some super-human that has the power to transform the world with a snap of fingers.  Icke is just presenting information -- which is NEUTRAL. He incorporates the conspiracy (what some of you people are crying about) and spirituality. Wouldn't Icke be cheating the readers by LEAVING OUT INFORMATION that some crybabies find that its only making it worse?

I never said he was a super-human, and having seen him in the flesh on several occasions I can assure you that he's just as human as the next guy. Information is neutral: yes, this is correct. I already made a similar statement myself. You're overly defensive reaction to my statements ("Crybabies"? Please) demonstrates that perhaps you're too emotionally close to the man and his work to really get an objective overview. Yes, he incorporates the conspiracy. Yes, he adds maybe a chapter of two of more spiritual information onto the end. But even the more spiritual stuff is usually just a dissection of the nature of the reality matrix in which we live. And, ultimately, just another thing to worry about: "We're trapped within the conspiracy, which is trapped within the matrix! But don't worry about any of that, because you're infinite love and you don't have to do a bloody thing about it!"

What he consistently fails to do is add any editorial into the mix that adds a solid overview to this information in such a way that a more complete perspective and understanding can be garnered. Icke is really good at sensationalism, I'll give him that. What he's lacking in is a balanced approach that presents solutions to the myriad of problems he writes hundreds and hundreds of pages about. It is simply my choice, right now, to say enough is enough. I'm tired of these endless lectures about the Illuminati and the bloody matrix. They are mired in negativity. Why do you think he's been allowed to get away with releasing this information for so long?

Mystery wrote:

Why the f*ck should Icke have to do something? He makes it clear that YOUR reality is in YOUR hands, it's up to YOU.... so why are you talking about Icke as if he's some God and his books are law?  I think you need to quit crying about the fact that Icke brings out all this negative information. What the f*ck do you think books on CONSPIRACY expos is going to be about?!?! Bees and butterflies????

There's that crying word again. My eyes are still quite dry over here, my friend. Clearly engaging in any dialogue with someone who's having such an emotional response, and who feels a need to use CAPS for emphasis, is probably going to be a waste of my time. I should have expected the Icke followers to come rushing to his defence here. Fortunately I won't be bullied into taking back anything that I've said on this thread. I'm sorry to say it, but I really did mean every word.

Oh, wait: I take that back. I'm not sorry.

"Fear is the great barrier to human growth. Unknowns create fears. When these Unknowns become Knowns the fears diminish and disappear, and we are able to cope with whatever confronts us." - Robert A. Monroe
  • From: Zion
  • Registered: 2004-09-28

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

montalk wrote:

Well, he does talk about the Merovingians and Project Monarch...

Excellent connection there, lol!

"Fear is the great barrier to human growth. Unknowns create fears. When these Unknowns become Knowns the fears diminish and disappear, and we are able to cope with whatever confronts us." - Robert A. Monroe
  • Registered: 2005-12-02

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

I never said he was a super-human, and having seen him in the flesh on several occasions I can assure you that he's just as human as the next guy. Information is neutral: yes, this is correct. I already made a similar statement myself. You're overly defensive reaction to my statements ("Crybabies"? Please) demonstrates that perhaps you're too emotionally close to the man and his work to really get an objective overview. Yes, he incorporates the conspiracy. Yes, he adds maybe a chapter of two of more spiritual information onto the end. But even the more spiritual stuff is usually just a dissection of the nature of the reality matrix in which we live. And, ultimately, just another thing to worry about: "We're trapped within the conspiracy, which is trapped within the matrix! But don't worry about any of that, because you're infinite love and you don't have to do a bloody thing about it!"

Wow, wow hold on...  I'm on the defensive not because I'm a fan of the mans work but because of the fact  that you're wasting all this energy ranting on a conspiracy writer that just happens to also talk about spirituality.  I'm just a little garbled why someone would put so much reliance on another person as opposed to self.  Only insecure people with serious psychological problems would be depended on him.  Are you telling me there is no books out there that focus on just spirituality or is Icke your only source of information and is that why you're so pissed off?   

And I only read two of his books (I am Me and I am Free / Infinite Love is the Only Truth) and from what I recall he does talk about meditation and how to be more open to your heart in Infinite Love.  Shit, I mean, if that's what you want... why not get a book on meditation and love?  You're not limited to Icke.

What he consistently fails to do is add any editorial into the mix that adds a solid overview to this information in such a way that a more complete perspective and understanding can be garnered.

And why should this person do something on the basis of one man's opinion?  He is NOTHING.........he doesn't have to do anything.  It is YOU who should be doing something.

I'm tired of these endless lectures about the Illuminati and the bloody matrix.

So quit reading his books and listening to his lectures.  No one's putting a gun to your head and forcing you.


There's that crying word again. My eyes are still quite dry over here, my friend. Clearly engaging in any dialogue with someone who's having such an emotional response, and who feels a need to use CAPS for emphasis, is probably going to be a waste of my time. I should have expected the Icke followers to come rushing to his defence here. Fortunately I won't be bullied into taking back anything that I've said on this thread. I'm sorry to say it, but I really did mean every word.

Oh, wait: I take that back. I'm not sorry.

It's funny when I point out the fact that Icke is nothing but a person like you and me and the fact that your future is in your hands instead of his I'm labeled an "Icke follower."

40 Reply by Neomatrix (edited by Neomatrix 2005-12-02 21:42:37)

  • From: Zion
  • Registered: 2004-09-28

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

Mystery wrote:

Wow, wow hold on...  I'm on the defensive not because I'm a fan of the mans work but because of the fact  that you're wasting all this energy ranting on a conspiracy writer that just happens to also talk about spirituality.  I'm just a little garbled why someone would put so much reliance on another person as opposed to self.  Only insecure people with serious psychological problems would be depended on him.  Are you telling me there is no books out there that focus on just spirituality or is Icke your only source of information and is that why you're so pissed off?

So, you're saying that you're on the defensive because you care so passionately about the manner in which I expend my energy? Awwwwww, thanks smile

The point here being that you are indeed on the defensive. What do you feel that you have to defend?

No, I don't depend on him. In fact, non-dependance upon Icke is almost at the heart of my issue here, from a certain point of view.

Mystery wrote:

And I only read two of his books (I am Me and I am Free / Infinite Love is the Only Truth) and from what I recall he does talk about meditation and how to be more open to your heart in Infinite Love.  Shit, I mean, if that's what you want... why not get a book on meditation and love?  You're not limited to Icke.

I have books by other authors already. You're missing my point though, because I'm not talking here about those other authors or their books. I'm talking here about Icke and the type of material that he is putting out.

Mystery wrote:

So quit reading his books and listening to his lectures.  No one's putting a gun to your head and forcing you.

Well, I believe that I did indeed say that I was going to quit reading his books already. So, we have no problems there.

Mystery wrote:

It's funny when I point out the fact that Icke is nothing but a person like you and me and the fact that your future is in your hands instead of his I'm labeled an "Icke follower."

Well, why else would you exhibit such a strong emotional reaction to my opinion of Icke? If you're not an Icke follower, then why get so defensive? There's simply no need. No reason at all for shouting at me in ALL CAPS, and no reason to make snide comments about being a cry baby just because I have a different opinion to you that I wish to share here. We okay now?

"Fear is the great barrier to human growth. Unknowns create fears. When these Unknowns become Knowns the fears diminish and disappear, and we are able to cope with whatever confronts us." - Robert A. Monroe

41 Reply by lyra (edited by lyra 2005-12-02 21:44:40)

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  • Registered: 2004-03-25

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

Mystery, you have great points.   I like what you're saying and found myself nodding my head.  Both you and Neomatrix have good points. 

What I think has happened here, and you can correct me if I'm wrong Neo wink  (you will anyway, who am I kidding!  big_smile )  is that you possibly had Icke on a pedastal for a number of years, then one day "woke up" you could say, and became disillusioned with him and the direction he was going.  He was no longer this hero figure who could do no wrong on that pedastal, he was now the flawed hero, letting you down.  It happens a LOT actually.   A friend of mine was talking to me about this last month.  The idea of people who put people on pedastals, treating them as almost God-like you could say, (not saying you saw Icke as God-like, just mentioning a possibly related phenomenon) then one day they wake up, see through it, change their opinion...then crucify that person they once worshipped.   The person being worshipped hasn't changed or done anything differently to deserve being crucified, it's the person who was doing the worshipping that changed.  In waking up and seeing the God-like figure for what they are - human, with flaws - they became bitterly disappointed.   

I found this interesting, as it is a genuine phenomenon.  Again, not saying it necessarily happened here, but I wanted to toss it out there in general for people to chew on.   Because there are a LOT of authors / speakers / internet personalities that have been put on pedastals by the public, not just Icke.  So it's good to take the opportunity to mention this, shed some light on it so people can take a moment and reflect on themselves, see if they're possibly engaging in this.    I was talking about Stuart Wilde with the same aforementioned friend, and mentioned that I truly LIKE the fact that I can find things that I disagree with him about.  I love it!  It means he's not a God guru figure, he's just human, like the rest of us, trying to figure it all out.  And in doing so, he makes mistakes along the way.   And I love it!    Nobody has all the answers, but problems arise when we put all our eggs in one basket, or begin to almost worship somebody and make them out to be more than they are.  Then it's not them who has changed, but rather, ourselves who have changed, when we finally wake up to it!    (god, that was almost a matrix quote..."....then you'll see it's not the spoon that bends, it is only yourself....."   haha!)

"Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "Holy shit ... what a ride!"  - Anonymous
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"I get by with a little help from my (higher density) friends."
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lyra's Website

  • Registered: 2005-12-02

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

Neomatrix wrote:
Mystery wrote:

Wow, wow hold on...  I'm on the defensive not because I'm a fan of the mans work but because of the fact  that you're wasting all this energy ranting on a conspiracy writer that just happens to also talk about spirituality.  I'm just a little garbled why someone would put so much reliance on another person as opposed to self.  Only insecure people with serious psychological problems would be depended on him.  Are you telling me there is no books out there that focus on just spirituality or is Icke your only source of information and is that why you're so pissed off?

So, you're saying that you're on the defensive because you care so passionately about the manner in which I expend my energy? Awwwwww, thanks smile

No, I don't depend on him. In fact, non-dependance upon Icke is almost at the heart of my issue here, from a certain point of view.

I sure got the feeling that you do.

I have books by other authors already. You're missing my point though, because I'm not talking here about those other authors or their books. I'm talking here about Icke and the type of material that he is putting out.

And why does this affect you so greatly?  Didn't Icke say to take all of his information with a grain of salt?  I personally don't believe in none of that reptilian bullshit but do you see me whining about it?  If he believes that reptilians rule over this planet and that George Bush is a lizard shape-shifter from Mars, than whatever, that's what he believes.  He can go suck on a reptilian cock as far as that theory goes. 

Well, why else would you exhibit such a strong emotional reaction to my opinion of Icke? If you're not an Icke follower, then why get so defensive? There's simply no need. No reason at all for shouting at me in ALL CAPS, and no reason to make snide comments about being a cry baby just because I have a different opinion to you that I wish to share here. We okay now?

Because I don't see no point in why you should get all whiled up over what this one person is saying.    And I wasn't shouting... I was trying to emphasize a point - that it's not up to Icke to do something, it's up to you and me and everyone else.  It's an inner battle.

43 Reply by Neomatrix (edited by Neomatrix 2005-12-02 22:06:27)

  • From: Zion
  • Registered: 2004-09-28

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

lyra wrote:

What I think has happened here, and you can correct me if I'm wrong Neo wink  (you will anyway, who am I kidding!  big_smile )

Nah, I'd be too scared of incurring your considerable wrath to do something like that wink

lyra wrote:

is that you possibly had Icke on a pedastal for a number of years, then one day "woke up" you could say, and became disillusioned with him and the direction he was going.

All correct, apart from the fact that I never really had him on a pedestal. I'm not given to elevating anyone to pedestal status. But it's true that I have a degree of respect and admiration for him, and in fact I still do. But there's also a degree of confusion as to why he's going around in circles so much, simply repeating the same information over and over. Something doesn't quite add up there. I'll admit that his last book was certainly more of a departure from the conspiracy format, but still tended towards the negative and sensational. And his website is still a constant source of doom and gloom. I have one friend who says she gets quite thoroughly depressed after simply skimming over his headlines page. And I quite understand that reaction myself.

lyra wrote:

The person being worshipped hasn't changed or done anything differently to deserve being crucified

No, but in Icke's case its the lack of change that is slightly mystifying to me. Even after more than a decade, he can still go out and do speaking events wherein he spends eight or nine hours on his feet pumping out the exact same information that he was giving out years ago. Is the man a robot?

Hmmmn. Maybe he is! Now there's a conspiracy for ya!

"Fear is the great barrier to human growth. Unknowns create fears. When these Unknowns become Knowns the fears diminish and disappear, and we are able to cope with whatever confronts us." - Robert A. Monroe

44 Reply by Neomatrix (edited by Neomatrix 2005-12-02 22:12:51)

  • From: Zion
  • Registered: 2004-09-28

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

Mystery wrote:

And why does this affect you so greatly?  Didn't Icke say to take all of his information with a grain of salt?  I personally don't believe in none of that reptilian bullshit but do you see me whining about it?

Nope, I don't. But I do see you whining at me for whining about it.

Mystery wrote:

If he believes that reptilians rule over this planet and that George Bush is a lizard shape-shifter from Mars, than whatever, that's what he believes.  He can go suck on a reptilian cock as far as that theory goes.

True. You may however have missed the point in my original posts when I said that the letter, although specifically addressed to him, was actually more targeted towards his followers. There was a really big hint there about my reason for starting this thread in the first place. I'll give you another really big hint: it was never really about Icke himself! Hence it being an open letter.

Neomatrix wrote:

In fact, if you read between the lines of my original post a little, you might get the impression that this letter - although specifically addressed to Icke - is actually more targeted at those who folks who actively (or naively?) follow his work rather than at the man himself.

That part specifically.

Mystery wrote:

Because I don't see no point in why you should get all whiled up over what this one person is saying.    And I wasn't shouting... I was trying to emphasize a point - that it's not up to Icke to do something, it's up to you and me and everyone else.  It's an inner battle.

Hooray, now we're reaching an agreement here! Of course, a battle has to be fought, doesn't it? And an inner battle takes a great deal of introspection, doesn't it? An ability to think and come up with one's own conclusions? Okay, now go read my original posts again, then maybe take in some of the other replies here from both myself and those smart folks, like Marcus, who actually understood what I was attempting to convey here. We're actually saying the same thing, you and I. You know?

"Fear is the great barrier to human growth. Unknowns create fears. When these Unknowns become Knowns the fears diminish and disappear, and we are able to cope with whatever confronts us." - Robert A. Monroe

45 Reply by Mystery (edited by Mystery 2005-12-02 22:25:36)

  • Registered: 2005-12-02

Re: An open letter to David Icke.

The difference between you and me is that you follow him to an extreme degree... I would get pissed off too if I was just presented with negative information from a sole source with no solutions.  Although his books (the ones I read) were just addressing the problem and little solution... they did show me the door and opened me to positive things such as meditation, astral projection, lucid dreaming and developing intuition.  If you put what he talks about in Infinite Love to use and enter that meditative awareness, you are not imprisoned by your mind and emotions thus become the observor instead of the experiencer... kind of like watching the movie, instead of being in the movie.  I find all his conspiracy stuff very interesting but I don't let it upset me.  I recall going to his site maybe once or twice -- the poor layout and disorganized manner in which the material is presented keeps me out.  But I do post at his forum sometimes though, which is where I saw this and decided to drop my $0.02.