271 (edited by Marcus 2005-11-17 06:13:48)

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

Lot of opinions here.  Funny thing about opinions - by definition the word means "point of view", and that in turn simply means someone's belief or understanding on something.  So clearly anyone and everyone has an "opinion" because opinions don't require experience.  Opinions are very cheap in every sense of the word.  For some reason people don’t like being kicked in the opinion, they bulk and search for some offence, then come up with all sorts of gumph and insults.  Some people even make fun little semantic prose.

So how does that relate to abductions?  Well there are those that have "opinions" about abductions, and those that have experience of abductions.  I am less inclined to be reading opinion after opinion, because ultimately they are worthless.

If someone can give me personal accounts and personal experiences of abductions then they are the people I am going to listen to.  In fact the whole thing is remarkably similar to the New Age movement.  There are a lot of people that "talk the talk" and have their "opinions", but so few of them actually can "walk the walk".

Unfortunately experience wins out every time.  So those that have a point-of-view or opinion on their personal experiences - even though they are certainly going to be subjective - are infinity more valuable than someone just spouting off based upon what they have read or what they believe.

And yes there are people on these forums that have abduction experiences.  Strange then that they are the ones that keep a focus on the issues rather than constantly getting sidetracked by meaningless twaddle...

272 (edited by Sowelu 2005-11-17 07:15:39)

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

Marcus wrote:

sidetracked by meaningless twaddle...

Is that an opinion, Marcus? wink

Speaking for myself, of course, my opinons aren't often stated, but when they are it is based on experience. The intellect is a fine tool, but it tends to be bias when it comes to forming opinions about anything it doesn't have first-hand experience with. And that bias will often serve it's desire for protection or aggrandizement, depending on the orientation of the ego regarding the subject matter. I agree there.

Back to points in this thread... Don't know if anyone has tried this, but it is possible to break the paralysis recently discussed if one musters enough will. Force eyes wide, center within and intend with self-respect and authority to move through the stasis (an arm, the head, anything). Now that means not coming from victim consciousness with pleas, not fighting as if there is a worthy opponent, and not coming from fear... of course.

It requires in the moment recognition of what's happening, owning it as a self-designed experience and intending to become fully conscious about it. Right then and there.

And to do that, there has to have been conscious work on the self within. Facing, feeling and clearing fears, specifically. Because the fears a person carries hidden within are the conduits of attack. They are the avenues of invitation into your energy field and field of experience. And in those confusing moments (like undesired paralysis or abduction), that fear deflates the potential benefit of one's will like a hole in a balloon. You will fall prey in that moment, even if you attempt to "fight", simply because so much of your life force is invested in fear and false understanding of what's really happening.

It is easy to fall as prey to things simply because we do not understand the forces at work. But we make our situation far worse by investing belief in false ideas regarding those forces at work. We disempower ourselves and lock our life into patterns of experience that further cinch the deal on our sense of slavery and imprisonment.

Remaining open and willing to face infinity unflinchingly - which does not mean wearing the defensive armor of a warrior, btw, but by trusting you will be perfectly fine no matter what happens - is the attitude of impeccability that will render a person inedible to those who feed off others. Regardless if they are non-souled manufactured entities or other predatory life forms.

And if you cannot trust you will be fine in those moments, recognize that it means you carry fear. Don't defend your dislike of the experience as reason to fight it and hate it and ignore that fear is your true motivator. Learn to trust that which gives you breath, and trust that your life is meant for more than to act as food for the moon or to remain entangled in relationships that disempower you and hamper your intention for growth and enlightenment.

Yes it takes work to get to that point in one's self energies so that one's will is firmly aligned with the highest potential. And it helps a whole lot if you toss the belief structures that disempower you before you even begin. The point to your experiences is you, not "them". The power lies with you, not "them".

"The most important decision you have to make is whether you live in a hostile or friendly universe."
~ Albert Einstein

The real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking new landscapes, but in having new eyes. ~Marcel Proust

The evolution of humanity is an evolution of the heart. The path is through the heart.

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

Sowelu wrote:
Marcus wrote:

sidetracked by meaningless twaddle...

Is that an opinion, Marcus? ;)

That would depend on precisely what twaddle I was referring to... :D

Also for those that are talking from experience how do you know you are talking about the samethings with each other rather than different but similar things?  That could potentially explain some of the different views and feelings...

274 (edited by Sowelu 2005-11-17 08:26:43)

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

Just a side note of intrigue here, considering another thread about time loops and whatnot...

Though many of the posts on this page of this thread were made and edited today, the software is listing both posts and edits as made yesterday.

EDIT: Ahhh... I see what it is. The clock says we just passed midnight here, in some time zone or other. LOL! Though it's 11:26 AM Eastern Time, by me.

"The most important decision you have to make is whether you live in a hostile or friendly universe."
~ Albert Einstein

The real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking new landscapes, but in having new eyes. ~Marcel Proust

The evolution of humanity is an evolution of the heart. The path is through the heart.

275

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

Choice wrote:

I think the only possible gray area for me
is if an individual chooses to meditate/ingest psychoactives/open the door, is this the 'invitation' that's necessary for the
abduction not to be considered a transgression of freewill, that if once through the door voluntarily, the individual does
not have the protective force or will to resist, that they are fair game? having entered a realm/dimension where there
are other laws.

This is a good point Choice. I beleive that ingesting DMT opens realms into other dimensional frequencies with both negative and positive entities. The trouble is knowing which is which, I also agree with Montalk in that although many of Strassman's DMT patients tried to put a positive spin on there encounters, they don't really know who or what there really dealing with.

I beleive that opening these doors haphazardly is a risky venture, that you really have to have your wits about you and know how to navigate these realms and also have a strong spiritual connection and energy as there are definetley beings that can and will take advantage of you. Take this poor patient who took DMT under Strassman's supervison and had a extremely traumatic encounter which may have been the reptillian race:

" There were two crocodiles. On my chest. Crushing me, raping me anally. I didn't know if I would survive. At first I thought I was dreaming, having a nightmare. Then I realized it was really happening. "

I was glad he didn't have the rectal probe in place, this being a screening day. Tears formed in his eyes, but stayed there.

"It sounds awful."

It was awful. It's the most scared I've ever been in my life. I wanted to ask to hold your hands, but I was pinned so firmly I couldn't move, and I couldn't speak. Jesus!

yikes Not too pleasent by the sounds of it!

p.s

If anyone wants of copy of DMT: Spirit molecule theres a Post in the links section where you can grab a copy.

276 (edited by Jen 2005-11-17 10:33:13)

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

Thanks for your posts, Sowelu--your broader perspective and depth of understanding of this subject is sorely needed here.  A few comments: 

Sowelu wrote:

Back to points in this thread... Don't know if anyone has tried this, but it is possible to break the paralysis recently discussed if one musters enough will. Force eyes wide, center within and intend with self-respect and authority to move through the stasis (an arm, the head, anything). Now that means not coming from victim consciousness with pleas, not fighting as if there is a worthy opponent, and not coming from fear... of course.

It requires in the moment recognition of what's happening, owning it as a self-designed experience and intending to become fully conscious about it. Right then and there.

As I've posted previously in this thread,  there's a sample statement suggested by Germane, one of the entities channeled by
Lyssa,  in the chapter about changing or stopping the abduction process: 

The first thing an individual can do is proclaim from a sense of empowerment (rather than from fear or a hope that the technique may work):  'I do not need this experience in the form that it is occurring. I desire to change this communication.' If the person has control of their verbal facilities, they can shout it.  They can think it. Or they can feel it emotionally. The stronger it is proclaimed in whatever fashion, the more impact it will have.

Germane goes on to say: 

The abduction experience really works in a very clear way with the idea that you are the creator of your reality.  On your Earth, you are not necessarily aware that when you think something, it manifests,  because there are many things between the original thought and the manifestation.  The abduction experience is more direct.  It plays on your beliefs about yourself and your world.  Therefore, if you believe you can be a victim, if you believe that somehow your world is being controlled--any of those types of beliefs--they will be played out and reflected back to you in the abduction experience.  So changing the experience means
changing those beliefs and proclaiming a new belief that you would like to express.

Sowelu wrote:

And to do that, there has to have been conscious work on the self within. Facing, feeling and clearing fears, specifically. Because the fears a person carries hidden within are the conduits of attack. They are the avenues of invitation into your energy field and field of experience. And in those confusing moments (like undesired paralysis or abduction), that fear deflates the potential benefit of one's will like a hole in a balloon. You will fall prey in that moment, even if you attempt to "fight", simply because so much of your life force is invested in fear and false understanding of what's really happening.

It is easy to fall as prey to things simply because we do not understand the forces at work. But we make our situation far worse by investing belief in false ideas regarding those forces at work. We disempower ourselves and lock our life into patterns of experience that further cinch the deal on our sense of slavery and imprisonment.

And this is the main reason I feel so strongly about this issue, and why I don't think it's productive to point accusatory fingers at the Grays.  As you say, it's a very disempowering stance.  Visitors From Within goes into this subject in depth. 

Bashar, a Zeta-human hybrid from the future, says in the chapter "Denial and Transformation",  that we have chosen a denied reality of the agreement we made with the Zetas: 

This denied reality of the agreement is what dictates how the visitations manifest for you. Therefore, you have chosen to not yet remember the calls of evolution. You have chosen to not yet remember who you are and your relationship to other nonterrestrial beings. By those choices, you automatically choose that this interaction will occur in the realms of denial.

On another level, one could say that you have chosen it in this way ot remind yourself that you are in denial and that you have the opportunity to change that state of being. Drawing a situation into your reality, from which you must face your denial, will allow you to begin to remember.

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

Interesting quotes, Jen. Thanks. I haven't read up on most material out there regarding this matter, nor do I see much need to, personally. I have a host of my own experiences to sift through in order to glean what's what. Though I'm not knocking the information, nor that it's available. Naturally there are many who can benefit from coming across it. I'm sure it can work like a trigger for many.

The fact that I haven't read much on it all, though I've experienced it, tells me that what I learned through my own processes must be accessible to others through their within, as it was for me through mine. And that is most inspiring to me.

My interest here in this thread is more in the people who are experiencing these life-draining, disempowering things, not the things themselves. People matter to me. And when people underestimate the innate power at their disposal due to distorted understanding of life, self and energy dynamics, I feel a desire to offer what I've uncovered along the way. Sometimes it's helpful, sometimes it's not.

"The most important decision you have to make is whether you live in a hostile or friendly universe."
~ Albert Einstein

The real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking new landscapes, but in having new eyes. ~Marcel Proust

The evolution of humanity is an evolution of the heart. The path is through the heart.

278

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

lyra wrote:

You're a Pro-Gray person, who is determined to keep at defending the Grays in an obviously anti-Gray/anti-abduction thread.   Then when the thread takes a direction you don't like, you take it upon yourself to say the thread should be scrapped - your own words.   So, I really don't know why I'm bothering at this point!

That wasn't what I said, lyra.  In responding to something you said about this being an anti-Gray thread and that perhaps another thread could be started to discuss other ideas about this, I said I would leave it up to montalk to decide whether we should do that, or scrap it altogether, because (as you said) "this is an anti-gray site." 

Something I confess I had not realized previously, but I have now.  Oh my, have I...

279

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

Sowelu wrote:

Interesting quotes, Jen. Thanks. I haven't read up on most material out there regarding this matter, nor do I see much need to, personally. I have a host of my own experiences to sift through in order to glean what's what. Though I'm not knocking the information, nor that it's available. Naturally there are many who can benefit from coming across it. I'm sure it can work like a trigger for many.

The fact that I haven't read much on it all, though I've experienced it, tells me that what I learned through my own processes must be accessible to others through their within, as it was for me through mine. And that is most inspiring to me.

My interest here in this thread is more in the people who are experiencing these life-draining, disempowering things, not the things themselves. People matter to me. And when people underestimate the innate power at their disposal due to distorted understanding of life, self and energy dynamics, I feel a desire to offer what I've uncovered along the way. Sometimes it's helpful, sometimes it's not.

Totally agree, Sowelu--it's not necessary to read the book in order to
access one's empowering truth in this matter.  For me,  as a metaphysician, it is of particular interest, for as Germane said, the abduction process works in a very clear way with the idea that you create your reality.  Ultimately I think we're coming from the same place here--I too have the desire to help wake people up to their innate power.  And, like you, I speak from my own experience in accessing that power within me.

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

I purposely avoided reading this thread for a long time - mainly because of issues / experiences I have with the whole situation.  Anyway, there is a lot of good info here.  A few people in particular seem to be avid posters on the subject...so maybe a few would care to share their personal experiences with Grey's?  Jen...I would really like to here any stories you have to share of any encounters you have had with Grey's.

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

This is provocative:

http://rigorousintuition.blogspot.com/2 … n-egg.html

"It's all in the egg"
"My observation of the Universe convinces me that there are beings of intelligence and power of a far higher quality than anything we can conceive of as human; that they are not necessarily based on the cerebral and nervous structures that we know, and that the one and only chance for mankind to advance as a whole is for individuals to make contact with such beings." - Aleister Crowley

Okay, here's where things get weird.

First, a few examples of what I'm talking about, before I try talking about it.

Copper Medic

In his book Confrontations, Jacques Vallee devotes a chapter to "Copper Medic," what he describes as his favourite case of UFO visitations. He writes that "what attracted the interest of local unfologists wasn't so much the repeated sighting of a small, egg-shaped UFO on the Chapin's property as the strange material they claimed to have recovered at the site."

It's not the strange material which attracts my interest, but the description of the UFO. In the first incident from 1969 the Chapins, who were then in their mid-60s, had just killed a rattlesnake. Jane Chapin was going to photograph the body "when she suddenly saw something behind the tall grass, among the trees":

She thought it was a trailer, then realized it was oval, about the size of a VW Beetle. It appeared cream-colored to her. Clint, who saw it from a different perspective, thought it was gray. Both saw how the object lifted up, paused for a brief moment, then disappeared at amazing speed. An oval depression, smaller than the object itself, was found in the ground, as if a large weight had rested there.

The Chapins had several more encounters over the years, sometimes losing consciousness, vomiting and urinating, when they would be hit by an "invisible barrier" radiating waves of heat. Their last encounter was in 1980, shortly before Clint's fatal heart attack. Jane wrote Vallee about it:

We were looking at a road that had been cut through our property and we turned to go down the road, west, and there was a skinny thing in the road, and his egg was not 25 feet from us... and he took four steps toward us and my hand fell on my gun and he turned around and walked back. He was in a gray suit, and he left no print or prints of the egg. Clint could not move either... the thing vanished, then the egg went up in the air and turned west, and we both looked at the back of the egg and it opened like a horse trailer door. He was four-foot tall and skinny, maybe 90 pounds. I don't know what he wants... well, maybe he will take me to where Clint is.

One of the local investigators reported, of one appearance, that the object "rose up off the ground a few feet, then took off like a shot up the canyon, swaying but not striking small trees as it went." But Jane Chapin admitted to Vallee she had lied: the object had flown off into the trees, passing through them as though they didn't exist. When he asked why she hadn't told that to the local investigators, she replied, "I could see they wouldn't believe me if I told them the truth. They were such nice people. I didn't want to shock them."

Lonnie Zamora

Zamora's sighting is one of the most famous in UFO literature. On April 24, 1964 Zamora, a police officer in Socorro, New Mexico, investigated a sudden, loud roar from an unpopulated gully. "I could see dust fly up," he recalled. "I thought there was something that night have blown up, since there’s a dynamite shack over there." He drove his patrol car to the top of a hill to check it out. About a half mile away, he saw a white object that appeared from the distance to be a car turned upside down, and two figures who looked to be four feet tall. Zamora radioed he was going to investigate, and drove a bumpy road on which he temporarily lost sight of the object. He stopped on a Mesa, got out and and looked down.

In the gully about 20 feet below him, the “thing”  sat silent. The two figures had disappeared. Zamora advanced closer.

"It was egg-shaped with one end, which I figure was the front, sort of tapered," Zamora says. "It was white and smooth, with no windows or openings of any kind. It was sitting on legs about four feet tall and seemed to be about the size of a car."

A sudden roar from the "egg" almost deafened Zamora. Thinking it might explode, the officer turned and ran for some bushes. Glancing back, he saw the object rise straight up. He dove into the bushes and covered his head, then peeked up.

"There was no noise," he says. "It was about 20 feet off the ground, just hovering. There were markings in red letters about a foot high on the side. It looked like a crescent with a vertical arrow pointed upward inside the crescent and a horizontal bar beneath that."

When State Policeman Sam Chavez arrived on the scene, he and Zamora entered the gully, and found a smouldering mesquite bush and six imprints in the ground where the "egg" had resisted. Zamora's character was judged unimpeachable, and there was no credible accusation of a hoax. He also made no claims for what he had seen. Three years later he told a reporter, “I’d like to know what the hell it was. I wouldn’t say it was from space or from here either. If it’s a new plane. It sure is good. All I know is I saw the thing and that’s it.”

Levelland and White Sands

On the night of November 2, 1957 near Levelland, Texas, independent witnesses repeatedly saw oval and elliptical objects near roadways. One witness was "Sheriff Weir Clem, who was searching the roads as a result of earlier reports and saw a reddish oval cross the road, illuminating the pavement." Within a few hours of the Levelland reports, "an Army jeep patrol at White Sands, N.M., reported an egg-shaped UFO that descended to a point about 50 yards above the bunker used during the first atomic bomb explosion, and a major wave of UFO sightings continued for 2-3 weeks."

The Worcester Egg

Early morning February 3, 2000, Georgina Wells saw an "extremely bright," yellow-glowing egg shape from her bedroom window. It began a slow descent, seemed to land out of sight, and then "came back into view and was really bright again and shot off into the sky and vanished. I have never seen anything go that fast before." Perhaps the most exceptional aspect of this report is that Wells claims a helicopter was monitoring it the entire time. "I stood up and watched it," Wells says. "It was not a police helicopter with its spotlight as there was no light-beam."

So what's with all the eggs?

There are many more examples. (And not just of the exterior appearance of UFOs. Abductees often describe rounded, milky interiors.) Still, I don't want to get carried away with this. Some UFOs, after all, have also been called "cigar-shaped." If Freud had been a ufologist, I expect he would have said that sometimes a cigar-shaped UFO is just a cigar-shaped UFO. But in the popular imagination, UFOs are principally "disc-shaped." And to speak of discs evokes manufacture, as though they were cobbled together with nuts and bolts, even if those nuts and bolts are cast from exoterran metals. So analogies are important in themselves, because they can restrict or liberate our assumptions of the true - as opposed to the black budget - phenomena.

What's more, regarding UFOs as egg-like also may render less myserious some of their observed, bizarre attributes. For instance, on numerous occasions, UFOs have been seen dividing into several equal-sized and identical parts, and recombining into a single unity. It beggers our understanding how a manufactured craft could be engineered to accomplish such feats, and perhaps just as significantly, what would be the purpose. However, we do see something like it in the natural world, in something as commonplace as cell division. But we may not think to look there if we get hamstrung by the paradigm that UFOs, if they exist at all, must be spacecraft. We'll be more likely to see correspondences in nature if we adopt the analogy of an egg, rather than a "disc."

And there may be something more, still.

Back to Crowley

Remember Lam, and Aleister Crowley's "Amalantrah Working"? Using sex magick with his partner and psychic sensitive Roddie Minor, Crowley claimed to have opened a dimensional portal, through which passed Lam, whose portrait appears an archetypal grey, though Crowley drew him "from life" in 1918, many years before the greys entered our cultural consciousness. Before Lam appeared, Minor channelled messages from a spirit-wizard called Amalantrah, who told Crowley to "find the egg." Ian Blake, who has much of interest to say about Crowley, Lam, and the egg metaphor here, writes that "one of the earlier versions of the Amalantrah Working ended with the sentence, 'It's all in the egg.' During the final surviving version of this Working, in reference to a question about the egg, Crowley was told: 'Thou art to go this way.'"

Kenneth Grant, Crowley's last student, who was given the portrait, is author of "The Lam Statement." Grant's purpose was to "regularize and to examine results" of contact with Lam, by "entering the Egg of Spirit represented by the Head." As Blake writes, "in the late 1980s ... Grant allegedly received 'strong intimations' to the effect that Crowley's portrait of Lam 'is the present focus of an extraterrestrial - and perhaps trans-plutonic - energy which the OTO is required to communicate at this critical period.'"

The Typhonian OTO, which follows Grant's teachings, "is concerned with effective transmissions and communications from 'outerspace' for the purpose of opening Gateways. The Typhonian 'deities' denote specific operations of psycho-physical alchemy which involve essences or elixirs secreted (thrown out and/or considered unclean) by the human organism."

And we should note that the purpose of Jack Parsons' "Babalon Working" was a birth, Using Enochian sex magick and his "elemental" partner Marjorie Cameron, Parsons was intent on collapsing our reality by introducing into it the incarnation of "Babalon." ("Wicked" in the angelic language said to be given Elizabethan John Dee.)

In a letter to Crowley, quoted in Sex and Rockets: The Occult World of Jack Parsons, he wrote "For the last three days I have performed an operation of birth, using the air tablet, the cup, and a female figure, properly invoked by the wand [penis], then sealed up in the altar. Last night I performed an operation of symbolic birth and delivery."

And from his poem, "The Birth of Babalon":

What is the tumult among the stars that have shone so still till now?
What are the furrows of pain and wrath upon the immortal brow?
Why is the face of God turned grey and his angels all grown white?
What is the terrible ruby star that burns down the crimson night?
What is the beauty that flames so bright athwart the awful dawn?
She has taken flesh, she is come to judge the thrones ye rule upon.
Quail ye kings for an end is come in the birth of BABALON.

Is it any more bizarre than the thought of extraterrestial spacecraft, to consider that Crowley and Parsons may have succeeded, the portal widened, and the ritual birth represented by egg-like manifestations? Well, yes, because it presumes the efficacy of magick, which is a big leap for most of us. But perhaps, even though it's more bizarre, it's also more likely.

One final thought. Lonnie Zamora repoted seeing "markings in red letters about a foot high on the side. It looked like a crescent with a vertical arrow pointed upward inside the crescent and a horizontal bar beneath that." To those who regard UFOs as nuts and bolts spacecraft, perhaps these markings would be regarded as the designation of an extraterrestrial authority. Their "flag." But it's quite anthropomorphic to presume aliens would think in such terms.

But if we consider ritual magick, the symbol resembles a "sigil," used for the invocation of angelic and demonic entities. I haven't searched yet for a crescent with a vertical arrow within it and a horizontal bar beneath it. But I wonder what the implications would be if one were found.

282

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

Marcus wrote:

I purposely avoided reading this thread for a long time - mainly because of issues / experiences I have with the whole situation.  Anyway, there is a lot of good info here.  A few people in particular seem to be avid posters on the subject...so maybe a few would care to share their personal experiences with Grey's?  Jen...I would really like to here any stories you have to share of any encounters you have had with Grey's.

Hi Marcus, note that I did not say specifically that I'd had encounters with the Grays--I said that I had experience accessing the power within me.
Of course, this can happen in many other ways than through the abduction experience. (Note:  I dislike using that word "abduction"; I think it just reinforces the mindset of victimhood.  So, from here on, I'm going to refer to these experiences as "visitations." )

It's been said that we've all had these experiences whether or not we recall them.  I've also heard that the visitations have more or less ceased or are leveling off, because the experimentation is complete.  But I'm very far from being an expert on these matters.  Anyway, I do recall one experience, some years ago, very vivid,  that may or may not be simply a dream:  I was lying on my back on a table, like an operating table, and there were beings standing around with their knives poised to stab me, but I was lying there totally relaxed, indifferent, looking at them as if to say, "You can't scare me!" 

I have had what most people would consider very disempowering experiences:  molestation in childhood, deafness, a very dysfunctional
family background that included alcoholism.  All of these strike at one's self-esteem and pose challenges in functioning effectively in the world.
Although I had many assets as a person, I still did not feel good about myself for a long time.  Metaphysical studies and much time spent in contemplation were helpful in my realization that my circumstances did not define me,  that everything in my experience was a reflection of myself in some way, and that there were no real limits to who I was and what I could do.  Realizing this on a deep level, one is no longer at the mercy of any so-called outside force.  So, that dream may have been a culmination of that realization, on some level.   I was meeting my own fears and letting them know I was the boss.  smile

This is not to say I don't ever have to deal with fears--I do, but I'm able to work with myself to get free of them, and the more I do this, the easier it becomes.

283

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

Jen wrote:

That wasn't what I said, lyra.  In responding to something you said about this being an anti-Gray thread and that perhaps another thread could be started to discuss other ideas about this, I said I would leave it up to montalk to decide whether we should do that, or scrap it altogether, because (as you said) "this is an anti-gray site."

So I guess the confusion lies then with what you meant by "it."  When you said "scrap it", it seemed you were referring to the thread.   There was also no clear statement saying "How about I go and start my own thread"......which issomething that does not require a moderator's permission, btw.     


Jen wrote:

Something I confess I had not realized previously, but I have now.  Oh my, have I...

I'm not sure why you wouldn't have realized this, or taken the time to peruse the website on which you post, but, nevermind....!


Jen wrote:

(Note:  I dislike using that word "abduction"; I think it just reinforces the mindset of victimhood.  So, from here on, I'm going to refer to these experiences as "visitations." )

But that's what's happening.   Sugar coating it doesn't change the nature of it.    That would be like telling the cow or chicken to call their experience at the slaughterhouse a "visit."     

"Cow, come with me, you're going to be 'visited' right now by the butcher....It's just a 'visit', okay, you're not being abducted and slaughtered, because that implies that you're a victim, and frankly, that word doesn't make me feel good....so it's just a 'visit'....no need to worry!   Everything's going to be ooooookaaaaay!"

"Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "Holy shit ... what a ride!"  - Anonymous
-----
"I get by with a little help from my (higher density) friends."
-----

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

Jen wrote:

Bashar, a Zeta-human hybrid from the future, says in the chapter "Denial and Transformation",  that we have chosen a denied reality of the agreement we made with the Zetas: 

This denied reality of the agreement is what dictates how the visitations manifest for you. Therefore, you have chosen to not yet remember the calls of evolution. You have chosen to not yet remember who you are and your relationship to other nonterrestrial beings. By those choices, you automatically choose that this interaction will occur in the realms of denial.

On another level, one could say that you have chosen it in this way ot remind yourself that you are in denial and that you have the opportunity to change that state of being. Drawing a situation into your reality, from which you must face your denial, will allow you to begin to remember.

So, in other words:   A human says "abduction is wrong."  The grey responds "you agreed to it already, and now you are just in denial."   Well, that sounds rather fishy to me.  I'd like to see some evidence of that!   The greys asking us to believe that they are here representing "the call of evolution" and that we've given them permission to forcibly kidnap us, but now are in "denial" about it sounds like a lot of baloney to me.   Think about what would happen if a human kidnapper was on trial and tried to use that as a defense ... "seriously your honor, she agreed to my 'visitations' before she was born!  And plus I'm only doing it to help her evolve spiritually."   Yeah, I bet that would go over really well.  And I don't see one reason to suppose the principle is any different when it's an alien doing the kidnapping instead of a human.   

The grey claim that "we agreed" to abductions is what in law is referred to as a "self-serving statement."  That means a statement which was made in order to benefit the speaker himself, and so cannot be accepted as evidence.  And it's a claim they obviously are unable to prove in any meaningful way, so they just make it and hope we're foolish enough to buy their story.   Their trick is in getting us to accept their story as truth in the first place because the moment we do that, we have CONSCIOUSLY granted them permission to continue taking us against our will.  Do you see?  It's a trick -- a PSY-OP designed to GAIN your permission which they didn't have in the first place.   The trick gets them the appearance of legality and legitimacy for their actions: it's no longer kidnapping once they'e gotten you to agree to it.

The ultimate result is that ETs could do whatever they wanted with a person like Jen, since she accepts their activities as "visitations" as opposed to abductions.   This is just classic warfare techniques being applied.   You don't march your troops into a new land and slaughter all the natives if you don't have to; it's much better to make them LOVE you and WANT you to rule them.  That way instead of decimating the area, you simply take control over the infrastructure that's already built, and use the people as your willing servants.  That's a much more efficient and effective way of doing things.

285 (edited by Jen 2005-11-17 15:03:36)

Re: Everything You've Been Told About the "Grays" is Bunk

morningsun76 wrote:

The ultimate result is that ETs could do whatever they wanted with a person like Jen, since she accepts their activities as "visitations" as opposed to abductions.   This is just classic warfare techniques being applied.   You don't march your troops into a new land and slaughter all the natives if you don't have to; it's much better to make them LOVE you and WANT you to rule them.  That way instead of decimating the area, you simply take control over the infrastructure that's already built, and use the people as your willing servants.  That's a much more efficient and effective way of doing things.

No one does anything "to" me that I don't allow on some level.  And, I'm no one's servant cool

EDIT:  On second thought, that's not completely true that I'm no one's servant.  I'm the slave of my cat, Ms. Magoo.  But she's so cute, I don't mind.

And no, she's not a Gray, she's a Black and White.  Hmm...symbolism...