• From: Germany
  • Registered: 2004-12-06

Topic: The Flow and its Origin

There’s a question in my mind that arose from thinking about the quote from Faust in this thread. There is a saying: "Suffering is caused through resistance against the flow (of life)" Now I wonder… The saying seems to presume that The Flow is a kind of external force one has to align with. In general, from my own experience, I agree with the saying… It depends on how one is able to abandon lower wishes, impulses and attachments how much one is prone to (internal) suffering.
Now the confusing part – who or what creates "the flow"? From the point of logic it must be the infinite composition of  all consciousness-centres - "The Creator" ultimately. It is obvious, that the flow of life, has its own inherent wisdom and order, but how is that achieved, if (on current earth) it is mainly formed by egoistic objectives. Do those objectives nevertheless serve a higher purpose? That would lead to the next question – where does ones personal will originate from? …and is there really a dichotomy between lower and higher impulses in the context of the universe/creation?
I hope I expressed myself fairly understandable. roll Any ideas regarding "the flow"?

A man is born gentle and weak. At his death he is hard and stiff.
Green plants are tender and filled with sap. At their death they are withered and dry.
Therefore the stiff and unbending is the disciple of death. The gentle and yielding is the disciple of life.
  • morningsun76
  • morningsun76
  • the answer has been with you the whole time
  • Offline
  • From: In two worlds
  • Registered: 2004-09-10

Re: The Flow and its Origin

heandras wrote:

Now the confusing part – who or what creates "the flow"? From the point of logic it must be the infinite composition of  all consciousness-centres - "The Creator" ultimately ...

... (on current earth) it is mainly formed by egoistic objectives.

I'd suggest that if it originates from Creator, then it is not formed by egoistic objectives.  If it appears to be so, it's probably a misperception.  Truth allows no contradictions, so I'd ask yourself why you feel that "the flow" would have anything to do with ego?

  • Registered: 2005-08-14

Re: The Flow and its Origin

It sounds like the stream explained in the Tao.
I think the meaning is the natural flow of the nature(Creator) in one's life and in all-  the lack of the duality in life, the right understanding of all's polarity and realizing that there's deeper meaning and purpose to all than just good/bad.
Actually it is the manifest of the Unego.

  • From: US
  • Registered: 2004-09-21

Re: The Flow and its Origin

Maybe the confusion comes from negative forces hijacking the concept and using it to justify conformity and obedience?  ie. you lost your job because you didn't go with the flow, you weren't a 'team player'.

Never Give Up!

freeme's Website

  • bumblebee
  • bumblebee
  • interdimensional intelligence analyst
  • Offline
  • From: tau ceti
  • Registered: 2004-10-18

Re: The Flow and its Origin

Morningsun, Heandras, I see ego not as necessarily flow constricting, just as I don't see hierarchies as necessarily flow constricting. They can both be beautiful structures through which we are able to align ourselves with the Flow. In this sense lower drives are not bad or flow constricting.
There is a difference between lower and higher drive dimension (as in es, ich, uberich) and the constriction of free expression dimension (which i think cannot be always related to the STO / STS dimension).
So what looks like a selfish act doesn't always have to be one and sex can be an expression of the flow.

the eyes of truth are always watching you

6 Reply by heandras (edited by heandras 2005-09-11 15:24:05)

  • From: Germany
  • Registered: 2004-12-06

Re: The Flow and its Origin

Thanks for the replies smile What originally caused the thought that ego and flow must be somewhat contrary was, that ego doesn’t want to be connected or even unified with something bigger – for me it’s a synonym for separation. What made me wonder, was the fact that, when I’m “in the flow"  things usually fall into place harmoniously. But oftentimes those synchronous occurrences are caused through decisions of people that are obviously not “in the flow"  So how do these synchronicities manifest if the flow doesn’t work “through"  them? Obviously it does. That reminds me of a passage in Alan Watts “Wisdom of Insecurity"  I read recently where is stated, that you can do what you want, it’s always the Tao, so there is no need to align with it.
I think the only choice one has is how you are going with the flow, not if. Compared with swimming in a river - one can decide to struggle against the stream and become knocked against rocks beneath the surface or one can watch out where the stream goes and calmly swim from left to right to avoid being injured. Regardless of the behaviour, the stream takes one with it.

A man is born gentle and weak. At his death he is hard and stiff.
Green plants are tender and filled with sap. At their death they are withered and dry.
Therefore the stiff and unbending is the disciple of death. The gentle and yielding is the disciple of life.