Topic: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

* 26 February 2005
* From New Scientist Print Edition.
* John Horgan
* John Horgan is a freelance science writer based in Garrison, New York. His latest book, Rational Mysticism (Mariner Books), was published in paperback last year

JOHN HALPERN clearly remembers what made him change his mind about psychedelic drugs. It was the early 1990s and the young medical student at a hospital in Brooklyn, New York, was getting frustrated that he could not do more to help the alcoholics and addicts in his care. He sounded off to an older psychiatrist, who mentioned that LSD and related drugs had once been considered promising treatments for addiction. "I was so fascinated that I did all this research," Halpern recalls. "I was reading all these papers from the 60s and going, whoa, wait a minute! How come nobody's talking about this?"

More than a decade later, Halpern is now an associate director of substance abuse research at Harvard University's McLean Hospital and is at the forefront of a revival of research into psychedelic medicine. He recently received approval from the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) to give late-stage cancer patients the psychedelic drug MDMA, also known as ecstasy. He is also laying the groundwork for testing LSD as a treatment for dreaded super-migraines known as cluster headaches.

And Halpern is not alone. Clinical trials of psychedelic drugs are planned or under way at numerous centres around the world for conditions ranging from anxiety to alcoholism. It may not be long before doctors are legally prescribing hallucinogens for the first time in decades. "There are medicines here that have been overlooked, that are fundamentally valuable," says Halpern.

These developments are a remarkable turnaround. Scientists first became interested in psychedelic drugs - also called hallucinogens because of their profound effect on perception - after Albert Hofmann, a chemist working for the Swiss pharmaceutical firm Sandoz, accidentally swallowed LSD in 1943. Hofmann's description of his experience, which he found both enchanting and terrifying, spurred scientific interest in LSD as well as naturally occurring compounds with similar effects: mescaline, the active ingredient of the peyote cactus; psilocybin, found in magic mushrooms; and DMT, from the Amazonian shamans' brew ayahuasca.

At first, many scientists called these drugs "psychotomimetics" because their effects appeared to mimic the symptoms of schizophrenia and other mental illnesses. However, many users rhapsodised about the life-changing insights they achieved during their experiences, so much so that in 1957, British psychiatrist Humphry Osmond proposed that the compounds be renamed "psychedelic", from the Greek for "mind-revealing". The term caught on, and psychiatrists started experimenting with the drugs as treatments for mental illness. By the mid-1960s, more than 1000 peer-reviewed papers had been published describing the treatment of more than 40,000 patients for schizophrenia, depression, alcoholism and other disorders.

A prominent member of this movement was Harvard psychologist Timothy Leary, who among other things tested whether psilocybin and LSD could be used to treat alcoholism and rehabilitate convicts. Although his studies were initially well received, Leary eventually lost his reputation - and his job - after he began touting psychedelics as a hotline to spiritual enlightenment. Leary's antics helped trigger a backlash, and by the late 1960s psychedelics had been outlawed in the US, Canada and Europe. Unsurprisingly, clinical research ground to a halt, partly because obtaining the necessary permits became much more difficult, but also because few researchers were willing to risk their reputations studying demonised substances.

But to some brave souls, psychedelic medicine never lost its allure. One of them is Rick Doblin, who in 1986 founded the Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies (MAPS) in Sarasota, Florida, and who earned a doctorate from Harvard's Kennedy School of Government after writing a dissertation on the federal regulation of psychedelics. For nearly 20 years MAPS has lobbied the FDA and other government agencies to allow research on psychedelics to resume. It has also persuaded scientists to pursue the work and raised funds to support them. A similar body, the Heffter Research Institute in Santa Fe, New Mexico, was founded in 1993 by scientists with an interest in hallucinogens.

In the past couple of years their efforts have begun to pay off. Doblin is optimistic that psychedelic research is back for good, and this time it will do things right. "This gives us the chance to show that we have learned our lessons," he says. Halpern, too, is anxious to lay to rest the ghost of Leary. "That man screwed it up for so many people," he says.

With this in mind, Halpern says the first task for him and others is to evaluate the safety of psychedelics. And they are up against an entrenched orthodoxy: a 1971 editorial in The Journal of the American Medical Association warned that repeated ingestion of psychedelics causes personality deterioration. "Only a few of those who experience more than 50 'trips' are spared," it warned.

So Halpern's first big foray into psychedelic research was aimed at risk-assessment. In the late 1990s he launched a study of members of the Native American Church, who are permitted by US law to consume peyote. Halpern examined 210 residents of a Navajo reservation in the south-west US, who fell into three categories: church members who had taken peyote at least 100 times but had had little exposure to other drugs or alcohol; non-church members who abstained from alcohol or drugs; and former alcoholics who had been sober for at least three months.

Halpern tested the subjects' IQ, memory, reading ability and other functions. His interim results showed that church members had no cognitive impairment compared with the abstainers, and scored significantly better than recovering alcoholics. Church members also reported no "flashbacks" - sudden recurrences of a psychedelic's effects long after the initial trip. Halpern believes this study, which he expects will be published soon, shows that contrary to the 1971 editorial, peyote at least can be taken repeatedly without adverse effects.

He is now conducting a similar assessment of MDMA. This drug is sometimes called an "empathogen" because it heightens feelings of compassion and reduces anxiety. Anecdotal reports suggest it has therapeutic potential, and some psychiatrists used it alongside psychotherapy before it was outlawed in 1985. However, anecdotal and scientific evidence have also linked MDMA with brain damage, though the research is controversial.
Ecstasy impact

Judging the true impact of MDMA is complicated by the fact that users often combine it with other drugs and alcohol. To get around this, Halpern recruited a group of American mid-westerners who admitted taking MDMA but said they shunned other substances. He separated them into "moderate" users, who had consumed MDMA 22 to 50 times, and "heavy" users, who had taken it more than 50 times.

Halpern recently reported in the journal Drug and Alcohol Dependence that, compared with controls, heavy users displayed "significant deficits" in mental processing speed and impulsivity. Moderate users, however, had no major problems. Halpern believes this shows that MDMA's benefits may outweigh its risks for certain patients. And apparently the FDA and the McLean Hospital agree, since both have approved Halpern's plan to test MDMA as an anti-anxiety drug for a dozen late-stage cancer patients. Halpern still needs permission from the Drug Enforcement Administration, but he expects to begin recruiting patients soon.

He is also interested in the potential benefits of the true hallucinogens. In 1996, he reviewed almost 100 substance abuse trials involving LSD, psilocybin, DMT and ibogaine, an extract of the African shrub Tabernanthe iboga. Halpern found tentative evidence that the drugs can reduce addicts' cravings during a post-trip "afterglow" lasting for a month or two. Exactly how this happens is something of a mystery. A popular theory is that the benefits stem from the drugs' psychological effects, which include profound insights and cathartic emotions, but Halpern suspects that there may be a biochemical explanation too.

For now, however, Halpern isn't planning to pursue addiction therapy. He is more interested in another medical use for LSD and psilocybin: treating a debilitating condition known as cluster headaches. These attacks appear to be caused by swelling of blood vessels in the brain and are worse than migraines. Sufferers say the pain exceeds that of passing a kidney stone or giving birth without anaesthetics. They affect about 3 in every 1000 people sporadically, and 1 in 10,000 chronically. "There's a tremendous potential need for this," says Halpern, who investigated the problem after being approached by a patient group.

Many patients get little or no relief from painkillers, but some claim that small doses of LSD or psilocybin can alleviate the headaches and even prevent them from occurring. Halpern was intrigued; LSD is chemically related to ergot, a naturally occurring compound that constricts blood vessels, and the derivatives ergotamine and methysergide are commonly prescribed for migraines.

Halpern and his Harvard colleague Andrew Sewell are now gathering evidence to persuade licensing officials - and themselves - that LSD and psilocybin merit a clinical trial. Sewell has gathered more than 60 testimonials from cluster headache sufferers who have treated themselves with LSD or psilocybin.

Another member of the vanguard in the psychedelic revival is Charles Grob, a psychiatrist at the Harbor-UCLA Medical Center in Los Angeles, California, and co-founder of the Heffter Institute. After years struggling to get permits, Grob says he is slowly moving forward with a study into using psilocybin to reduce distress in terminal cancer patients. He points out that studies done in the 1960s suggested that psychedelics can help patients come to terms with their impending death. So far Grob has treated three patients, but he hopes to enrol more subjects shortly.

Grob has also led several investigations like Halpern's peyote study, but looking at ayahuasca, the DMT-rich shamanic brew. Ayahuasca often causes nausea and diarrhoea, and its psychedelic effects can be terrifying, but Amazonian shamans nonetheless prize it for its visionary properties. Since 1987 it has been a legal sacrament for several churches in Brazil, the largest of which is Uni £o Do Vegetal. UDV combines elements of Christianity with nature worship, and claims 8000 members.

In 1996 a team led by Grob reported in the Journal of Nervous And Mental Disease that UDV members who regularly took ayahuasca were on average physiologically and psychologically healthier than a control group of non-worshippers. The UDV followers also had more receptors for the neurotransmitter serotonin, which has been linked to lower rates of depression and other disorders. Many of the UDV members told the scientists that ayahuasca had helped them overcome alcoholism, drug addiction and other self-destructive behaviours.

More recently, Grob has found that adolescents who grew up participating in ayahuasca ceremonies showed no ill effects and were less likely to engage in crime and substance abuse than members of a control group. Of course, Grob acknowledges that they could be benefiting from the social effects of membership in a church as well as the effects of ayahuasca itself. Grob plans to publish these results this year.

Several other scientists are quietly pursuing psychedelic research. Since 2001, psychiatrist Francisco Moreno of the University of Arizona in Tucson has been testing psilocybin as a treatment for obsessive-compulsive disorder. Psychotherapy and antidepressants such as Prozac help many patients, but some have such severe symptoms and are so resistant to treatment that they turn to electroshock therapy and even brain surgery. As with the work on cluster headaches, Moreno's study was motivated by reports from people with OCD that psilocybin relieves their symptoms.

So far, Moreno has given both sub-psychedelic and psychedelic doses of pure psilocybin to nine treatment-resistant OCD subjects, in a total of 29 therapy sessions. His preliminary findings suggest firstly that it is safe to ingest psilocybin, which was a primary concern of the trial. Beyond that, Moreno calls his results "promising", but won't discuss them further, since he plans to submit a paper to a peer-reviewed journal this year.

Meanwhile in Charleston, South Carolina, physician Michael Mithoefer is carrying out a MAPS-sponsored clinical trial of MDMA as a treatment for post-traumatic stress disorder. PTSD affects up to 20 per cent of people who experience a traumatic event, and involves distressing symptoms such as nightmares and panic attacks. Conventional treatments typically consist of cognitive therapy and antidepressants, but many patients don't respond to these. In the past year Mithoefer has given "MDMA-assisted" psychotherapy to six treatment-resistant patients, all traumatised by violent crimes; he plans to treat 20 patients in all.

The longest-running psychedelic therapy programme started almost 20 years ago in Russia. Evgeny Krupitsky, a psychiatrist who heads a substance-abuse clinic in St Petersburg, has treated more than 300 alcoholics and about 200 heroin addicts with ketamine. Used primarily in veterinary medicine, ketamine is an anaesthetic that can trigger an extremely disorienting hallucinogenic episode lasting an hour or so. Krupitsky's subjects often emerge from their sessions filled with revulsion for their past lives and determined to change. The therapists encourage these feelings with tricks such as forcing the subjects to sniff a bottle of vodka at the peak of their session; the patients' disgust often persists long after the ketamine's effects have worn off.

In one of Krupitsky's studies, 73 out of 111 alcoholics stayed dry for at least a year after their session, compared with 24 per cent of those in a control group. Yet his programme, which was funded by MAPS and the Heffter Institute, was recently shut down because the Russian government tightened restrictions on ketamine. Although Krupitsky says he and his colleagues "are in the process of getting permission to continue", it may be several years before research resumes.

Although disappointed by this setback, Doblin is encouraged by developments elsewhere. He is lobbying officials in Spain and Israel to approve studies of MDMA for PTSD, and is raising funds for a substance-abuse trial of ibogaine outside the US together with the Heffter Institute. MAPS has also supported Frans Vollenweider, a psychiatrist at the University of Zurich in Switzerland, who has done basic research on the physiological effects of psilocybin and MDMA, and hopes to begin clinical research soon.

Doblin's primary goal is to see psychedelics legally recognised as medicines. But he also hopes that someday healthy people may take these substances for psychological or spiritual purposes, as members of the Native American Church and Uni £o Do Vegetal do, and as he did in his youth. After all, drugs such as Prozac and Viagra are already prescribed not just to heal the ill but also to enhance the lives of the healthy.

It is still an uphill struggle. Government funds for psychedelic studies are hard to come by, and drug companies have shown absolutely no interest in supporting the research. But there are signs that the wind is changing. Although psychedelics are still classified in the US as schedule-1 drugs, and so are banned for all non-research purposes, in November a US Federal Appeals Court in Colorado ruled that a branch of the UDV based in Santa Fe, New Mexico, could import ayahuasca for use in ceremonies. Among the research findings cited in the court decision were Grob's studies showing no ill effects from ayahuasca. The Department of Justice is appealing the decision, but if the Supreme Court denies the appeal, UDV members in the US will be able to ingest ayahuasca legally.

Maybe, just maybe, after more than 30 years in the wilderness, this powerful, misunderstood but potentially mind-healing class of drugs is ready to be rehabilitated.

Join me in Peru to celebrate December 21st 2012 - Visit: http://2012awakeningretreat.com/

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

Hi Andy,

Can't help thinking of psychadelics as short cuts or even potential short-circuits in the learning process. The question for me is "what are you looking for when taking them?"

For some it can be a wonderful insight into their inner self - a possible leap into a 4th density expereince. But with our 3d perspective, what can we learn from this?. How many of us are able to process the information given our programming?. Is it not more efficacious and less "wild and weird" to take a pace that is more in tune with where we start from?. Just the questions I pose to myslef for consideration before I leap into unknown territory.

Plus there is always the concern that one must be led or guided by another who claims to be more knowledeable in this field. Being fiercely independent after many painful life initiations which involved givng my power to others, I am not keen to give my mind over to energies or entities I know little of. So maybe it comes down to a question of who you would trust to guide you through the many caverns of consciousness yet unplumbed.

At this point in time I am happy to walk at the pace dictated by my own knowing. I take melatonin regularly after hearing of it during my time in the Cassiopaea experiment. Bieng African I have a higher melatonin content in my system, so find that I do not need to take much. Just 3mg daily. Thus far, it is helping me to clear the dross in my mind enabling a much gentler access to my inner psyche. Much better sleep patterns too, and feelig more energised when I wake.

I also have memories of one former life in particular, where I was a shaman type person who went completely loopy after over reliance on these plant allies, at the expense of my own inner work. Absolutely horrific memories, and a traumatic transition that took a while to process/heal from.

I am concluding that short-cuts have many unknown obstacles. If you fall, you may accidentally find yourself lost in another dimension with not enough knowledge to find your way back. This is something I considered when I worked in a psychiatric hospital and tuned in to some who had gone over the edge thorough unguided/unguarded use of such substances. Free will is great, but knowledge protects.

This is an extract from the Cs re: psychadelics and their possible impact on spiritual growth. Just for your consideration. Good luck in your exploration. The key thing concerning me is how crystal clear  the intent is before the  journey begins .... Most peope I know including myself are just not prepared for another dimension of experience - at least at an accelerated rate, which is what is implied in the psychadelic journey. No wonder it is called a trip....

V

From session: 991023

C session wrote:

......you have lost a fan because he was not happy with what he considered to be "internal inconsistencies" in that
you were NOT favorably disposed toward hallucinations
produced by substances such as Mescaline and Ayahuasca,
but yet you recommend Melatonin because it is a
hallucinogen. Then, you said that spiritual powers could not
be obtained through chemicals or plant type means, but then
said that Melatonin exercises psychic abilities. Could you
comment on this?
A: Several comments: First of all, "fan" is short for "fanatic."
Secondly, melatonin does not force an alteration in
physiological brain chemicals, as do mescaline, peyote, LSD,
etc. Accessing the higher levels of psychical awareness
through such processes is harmful to the balance levels of the
prime chakra. This is because it alters the natural rhythms of
psychic development by causing reliance on the part of the
subject, thus subjugating the learning process. It is a form of
self-imposed abridging of free will. Melatonin simply allows
the system to clear obstructions in the brain chemistry
naturally, thereby allowing the subject to continue to learn at a
natural pace. And, it is by no means unimportant that
melatonin is a natural body hormone. The other substances
mentioned are, at least in part, synthetic, with the exception of
peyote. But even that is not a natural ingredient of the human
physiological being. And besides, we have already discussed
the importance, or lack thereof, of those who pass judgment
upon this exercise, or communication.

The truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

some like it fast, others like it slow.

for many these psychedelics are door openers, doors that wouldnt have even existed in some cases unless the mind was expanded with these drugs. yes, maybe later on down the road we would have realized, but then again maybe not.

i say whatever helps you on your journey is great. we're all different, we all learn different.

on the same token, you have to be consciously aware of your dosage, no matter what you're talking about: drugs, information, food -  too much of anything can be potentialy dangerous (except love- the exception to all!!!)

smile

"...i was taken by the hand, from the ocean to the sand..."
nitin sawhney - 'eastern eyes'

4 (edited by Vuyiswa 2005-02-26 09:17:49)

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

Hi z,

Of course freewill is paramount. I was/am just sharing where I am at, and the thinking and experiential processes that led me to my present. No intent to diss Andy's quest, though it may be taken that way and there is nought I can do about that except to clarify my intention in discussing the issue.

Whatever floats your boat. We do indeed learn in our own unique way(s). That's part of the majestic beauty of life in the universe.

Even with love, it is not so much the dosage, but the application relative to the given circumstance. There is always the potential for an inappropriate infusion of compassion. For example the begger that is stuck in that mode of seeking to survive, or the depressive that feeds off others' compassion without moving forward. Both are energetic drains, but we always have the choice as to whether we assist in their process and take the drain on our material and psychic ressources, or cut off the supply.

All in the name of love of course smile 

V

The truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

C's wrote:

This is because it alters the natural rhythms of
psychic development by causing reliance on the part of the
subject, thus subjugating the learning process. It is a form of
self-imposed abridging of free will.

This is exactly how I understand it. Since you jump to other levels without having learnt the lessons by yourself, through your daily life, then you become stuck between two realities.

As for psychedelics to heal the mind? This was much promoted by disinformation agents such as Timothy Leary or Robert Anton Wilson. R.A.W. called it "deprogramming". All you do, in reality, is replace a belief-system with another, an illusion with another, which has nothing to do with the long and difficult work of deconditionning as explained in books on Toltec wisdom (among others). We need to find again our healing powers, and we don't need any substances for that.

6 (edited by lyra 2005-02-26 10:39:28)

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

ermolai wrote:

 

C's wrote:

This is because it alters the natural rhythms of
psychic development by causing reliance on the part of the
subject, thus subjugating the learning process. It is a form of
self-imposed abridging of free will.

This is exactly how I understand it. Since you jump to other levels without having learnt the lessons by yourself, through your daily life, then you become stuck between two realities.

Thank you........that's exactly what I said about psychodelics in another thread about a month or two ago but um.....it didn't exactly "go over too well" you could say.   wink  wink   



ermolai wrote:

As for psychedelics to heal the mind? This was much promoted by disinformation agents such as Timothy Leary or Robert Anton Wilson. R.A.W. called it "deprogramming". All you do, in reality, is replace a belief-system with another, an illusion with another, which has nothing to do with the long and difficult work of deconditionning as explained in books on Toltec wisdom (among others). We need to find again our healing powers, and we don't need any substances for that.

Agree with you here as well.    I haven't seen ANY redeeming qualities about hallucinogens.   NONE, not one.   Can anybody who's tripped on acid, LSD, etc. etc. seriously claim that they benefitted from it??!   

Back in '95 I had a buddy named Zach who was tripping on acid one night.   Had a little vial of clear liquid that he was soaking a sugar cube in and sucking on.  I babysat him that night, and his friends, driving them around as they babbled incoherantly in my car, getting them food, making sure they were okay, etc. etc.   I wasn't impressed by what I witnessed.    When I sat on a chair in his friend's place as Zach leaned into me, with the little vile, and the sugar cube, whining and begging me, pleeeease, pleeeeeeeease, come on, pleeeeeeease???  pleeeeeeeease.....just take a little.......pleeeeeeease....I just wasn't impressed.   There was nothing worth doing it for.   What, so I could babble incoherantly?   Blubber and babble and be useless, unable to get myself from point A to point B???    Why, for what???  A few years later when I was asking about Zach I heard, with a sad head shake, that he was "fried."    Gone, fried, bye bye.

What's interesting about Zach is that he wasn't just some stupid druggie kid.   He was one of the most psychic people I've ever known.   Was way into shamanism.    Him and his friend Andrew (another buddy of mine) claimed to be able to shapeshift when they'd go off into these drug-induced other realms.    Andrew claimed to be a wolf when he shapeshifted, I don't remember what Zach was.  But Andrew actually LOOKED like a wolf, acted like a wolf, was born in year of the dog, and had "wolf eyes".     Very um, interesting pair those two were.   Zach goes down though as being one of the most psychic people I've ever met, although Andrew definitely wasn't lacking in the psychic department either.  I do tend to think it was the drugs that enabled / enhanced that.     Unfortunately, the price isn't worth paying.   To me.    I'd rather be the tortoise, not the hare, and take my sweet time getting to that point, developing my psychic abilities via the long route of learning and life and lessons.   Do it the old fashioned way..........hard work.   It's far more rewarding and fulfilling.......doesn't circumvent the learning process.........and has absolutely no physical side affects and hazards.   

Work, people.   Not shortcuts which fry your brain.    What good is your few moments of "insight" when you become too mentally fried later to appreciate it??? 

Oh...and on a sidenote.......my mom was an acid head in highschool.   My dad told me this.   She was this little 9th grader trying to coerce my dad....a senior!!!!...........to drop acid.   !!    She was always dropping acid, drinking, smoking pot, you name it.   He was only into pot..........and instinctively knew -- just like me -- to stay the hell away from acid.    Never touched it.

I don't know, I just find that interesting.   wink

"Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "Holy shit ... what a ride!"  - Anonymous
-----
"I get by with a little help from my (higher density) friends."
-----

7 (edited by zonabi 2005-02-26 10:49:47)

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

All you do, in reality, is replace a belief-system with another

but, isnt this what you would be doing even without the drugs, as you begin to realize and "deprogram/decondition" yourself from the system thats enforced on us here? sounds like a pretty broad generalization.

i can relate to what lyra just said above, about those 'perma-fried' people who took it over the edge... thats why Acid isnt very good, mushrooms and other natural herbs such as Ayahuasce are much better than synthetic man made (and government tested/manipulated) drugs...

again, all within moderation.

oh, and another thing worth mentioning, more on topic with Aya's thread- is how some researchers who like to use MDMA in tests get harrassed/even jailed by the government from time to time nowadays...

makes you wonder why they dont want these researchers to progress....

"...i was taken by the hand, from the ocean to the sand..."
nitin sawhney - 'eastern eyes'

8 (edited by Ayahuasca 2005-02-26 13:24:06)

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

lyra wrote:

Can anybody who's tripped on acid, LSD, etc. etc. seriously claim that they benefitted from it??!

I don't know much about acid specifically, and from what I know it does seem to be the one hallucinogen that is most responsible for 'frying' peoples brains. That's why I stay away from it and stick with nature (Mushrooms and Ayahausca).

But if you mean has anyone benefitted from taking any kind of hallucinogens then I would say YES, YES and thrice YES. Without a shadow of a doubt. Have you forgotten that Ayahuasca's primary use is for HEALING!? I personally know dozens of people but I'm sure many thousands of people in this world have benefiitted from taking hallucinogens. If you ever went to Brazil with Heart of the Initiate then you would see for yourself how people can benefit.

What I think most people here are forgetting is that there are generally two types of people who use hallucinogens. There are recreational users, with no spiritual leanings, who have no respect for the drugs and it's THESE people who end up frying their brains eventually. Then there are intelligent/spiritual users, who educate themselves and understand what they are doing, and have total respect for the plants and their spirit. Rarely do these people ever do any damage to themselves.

The one thing that I generally find annoying about the people who speak loudly against the use of hallucinogens is that in nearly every case they know almost nothing about the subject. They've done no real research, not read any books and certainly never taken them for themselves.

I don't mean to criticize you Lyra, but if you had read ANYTHING of any substance on this subject you would never ever have to ask the question "Can anybody claim they have benefitted from it?" The fact that you have to ask that question says that you know virtually nothing about the subject.

I've recommended several books on the subject in several threads now and I'm willing to bet that nobody here has gone out and looked for them. Has anybody even read "Food of the Gods" yet which you can download for free from my directory of the Noble Realms file area?

Other books I like to recommend are:

"Breaking Open The Head"  http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/ … 78-3164055

"DMT: The Spirit Molecule: A Doctor's Revolutionary Research into the Biology of Near-Death and Mystical Experiences
"
- http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/de … s&st=*

"Antipodes of the Mind: Charting the Phenomenology of the Ayahuasca Experience
"
- http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/ … 78-3164055

"Cosmic Serpent: DNA and the Origins of Knowledge"    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/de … p;v=glance


Vuyiswa wrote:

Can't help thinking of psychadelics as short cuts or even potential short-circuits in the learning process. The question for me is "what are you looking for when taking them?"

What am I looking for?

I don't know, what are any of us really looking for? Love, knowledge, Deeper Understanding, Peace. An answer to the questions "Who am I?, What am I here for? Or is there even a reason?"

Why do we read books, what are we hoping to gain? Knowledge? Isn't all knowledge already within us though? So do we really need books? Maybe everything in books is completely wrong, how could we ever know?

Personally I just like to experience things. I think hallucinogens can help you achieve a certain level of gnosis about things. 

The gnosis that I personally got was about the godforce and I benefited from that experience in more ways than I could ever describe.

Stuart Wilde wrote:

"I'll never forget the day I had my first experience up the other end of the near-death tube, where I actually perceived the God Force. This isn't thinking about the God Force, or a faint feeling- this is actually seeing it. The enormity of that energy is indescribable. It's exquisite beyond words. The love and compassion-there is no way to quantify and comprehend that amount of love. But what that experience did for me was to instantly throw out about 75 percent of the stuff that I believed. At the time I had my first experience of the Light, I'd been working on myself for many years, so  I had already liberated my psychology and philosophy a tremendous amount. Yet standing in the light of the God Force, I felt embarrassed-a lot of my philosophy was pathetic compared to a view of the real thing."

Now that's almost a perfect description of what I experienced on one of my Ayahuasca journeys. And who can honestly say they don't think they would benefit from an experience like that?

For about 3 or 4 hours I had this absolutely incredible loving force of energy blasting through every cell in my body. And it was wonderful! And it changed everything - for the better!

You can read or talk about the godforce, you can believe in the godforce but nothing will ever prepare you for actually experiencing it. It totally changed my view on just about everything and made me a far more loving and peaceful person than I was before that experience.

I've taken ayahuasca only 10 times now and only once did I experience anything like that, but each time I've learnt something that's been helpful to me or gained some new insight into who I am.

And no I don't really see it as a shortcut. I'd been on the spiritual path for nearly 10 years when I had my first ayahuasca experience. 10 years of learning, reading, growing, developing. Then I felt ready to take things to a new level.

And then spirit said to me "Go to Brazil brother Andy" And so I went, and I've never looked back since. big_smile

It's almost 2 years now since that first trip and what a freakin' ride this last 2 years have been for me. Meeting shamans, meeting Stuart, meeting so many cool people (including you all you guys here! smile smile ) But still learning, growing, developing even more. Still reading 2-3 books a month on average, but now when I read about the godforce I can smile a knowing smile and nod my head, and remember and think to myself "I'm so glad I KNOW that" big_smile

Ultimately Ayahuasca's most important lesson is about love. If there's one common theme running through most peoples descriptions of their ayahuasca experiences, it's love. Not love as some intellectual concept, but love as a force that is absolutely real, and that is ultimately behind everything in this universe.

Life took on a new glow after my first aya experience, and one that has stayed with me ever since. I've never in my life suffered from depression, but I know now that I never will. Depression and me just don't go together, but since that aya experience I've been much more happier and joyful and rarely do I ever get down these days. That's another benefit I would say!! big_smile

Ayahuasca is also about remembering. It can connect us with divine realms and remind us who we really are. It show's us that there really is no separation.

You might say "Well we're human, we're not supposed to connect with divine realms, we've got to learn how to get there first" To which I would say "Well that's YOUR opinion!" wink

On Heart of the Initiate:

Ralph Miller wrote:

Ancient religious traditions and esoteric thought speak of how everything is connected to everything else. This is the concept of oneness, where duality and separateness break down and become irrelevant, and only a perfect unity remains. Our real nature is that we are not separate; we are all one. Our human experience feels lonely and isolated only because we have forgotten our true nature.

The renowned Swiss scientist, Jean Paiget wrote about human intelligence in his book Origins of Intelligence in the Child. His observations were that for an infant … all is one. Infants are unable to determine where they end, and the world or universe begins. They cannot distinguish their 'inner world' from their 'outer world'. They perceive their reality as One.

When we are born, we begin with this true understanding. We begin with a visionary mind. As we grow up, we begin to forget.

There is a grand paradox that has continued for eons now. We have evolved in our mastery of technology, but we have forgotten our true nature. As human intelligence has increased so has our 'forgetfulness'. We have forgotten and become disconnected from ourselves. A part of our minds has de-evolved. We no longer can perceive the beauty of the infinite realms that are woven into our 3D consensual reality we call time-space.

The human journey is about remembering. The sacred shamanic traditions of the Amazon re-activate the visionary brain. A part of our brain turns on again. When you perceive the indescribable beauty of this connectedness, you will feel as if you are remembering something that you had forgotten about a long time ago. You feel as if you have woken up from a dream. In this field of total connectedness, it is impossible to comprehend how you felt lonely and isolated. Welcome to the real world!

Again, that's good description of what can happen on an ayahuasca journey. On most of my journeys I've felt such a strong connection to spirit and to everything around me and without question I've benefited from these experiences.

I've never, and probably will never, claim to have any really deep understanding of god, the universe and the nature of reality. But, if nothing else, Ayahuasca has taught me, and enabled me to fully experience two very important things. The godforce and the connectedness of everything.

Lyra wrote:

Work, people.   Not shortcuts which fry your brain.    What good is your few moments of "insight" when you become too mentally fried later to appreciate it???

Educate yourselves people!!! Research things before you make statements that aren't true!!

Ayahuasca doesn't fry your brain and nor is it a shortcut to anything. On the contrary (and this was is in the article I just posted above) ayahuasca has been shown to improve and increase brain functioning, not harm it.

John Horgan wrote:

In 1996 a team led by Grob reported in the Journal of Nervous And Mental Disease that UDV members who regularly took ayahuasca were on average physiologically and psychologically healthier than a control group of non-worshippers. The UDV followers also had more receptors for the neurotransmitter serotonin, which has been linked to lower rates of depression and other disorders. Many of the UDV members told the scientists that ayahuasca had helped them overcome alcoholism, drug addiction and other self-destructive behaviours.

But on the whole work thing. I do work on myself and have been doing for over 10 years now. I'm 29 and I've have been reading about spirituality since I was about 18 (and UFOs and paranormal since I was about 10). I think I got heavily into Stuart Wilde when I was 21. So it's not like I just got into spirituality yesterday and decided to go straight for the red pill.

The same goes for the vast majority of people I met in Brazil. With just a few exceptions they have almost all been longterm spiritual seekers looking to take their experience and knowledge to a new level.

I specifically remember one guy last year who was in his 50's, from Vancouver, who had been on the spiritual path a looooong time, had never taken any drug or hallucinogen before in his life, and in his own words he said he'd got as far as he could go and wanted "to take things to a new level"

When I asked him at the end of the week if he'd got what he wanted he just said "oh Yeah!" and gave me a big smile. He didn't need to say anything more than that.

Finally I'll leave you with a short article, written by the shaman I was with in Brazil last year, in which he explains why he thinks ayahuasca is important:

Kajuyali Tsamani wrote:

Ayahuasca, ways of curing and knowledge.

We live in times in which it is urgent to find and to construct a way to live a physically and spiritually healthy life. The sacred Ayahuasca plant (Banisteriopsis caapi) offers us ways of curing and knowledge that allow us to activate a worthy way of existence, to live in harmony with the Cosmos and to find ourselves as children of our Mother Earth. When we lived our process on gestation and formation in our mother, we received our fundamental food by means of the navel-string.

The Ayahuasca vine is the navel-string of the Cosmos, the Pachamama. This navel-string arises from the entrails of our Mother Earth, to nourish us with health and knowledge adapted to the vital energy of the Cosmos. In our bodies, in our society and in our culture exists an inheritance of diseases. During many years we have forgotten we are children of Mother Earth and we dedicated ourselves to destroying great parts of her vital manifestations. Under this ominous activity we transformed and we changed our better and suitable habits of life for the worse. By sickening and destroying great parts of life on Earth, we ourselves are becoming ill and are destroying our physical and spiritual health.

Because of this, not a single human being exists that does not suffer from one or the other problem of physical or spiritual health. We are all ill and we are all responsible for it. It is urgent to find a way of healing and knowledge so that our way of life will be full of good health in body, mind and spirit, of vital energy and natural surroundings, on a social and cultural level. The sacred Ayahuasca plant offers us that way of healing.

Ayahuasca (Banisteriopsis caapi) grows naturally in the regions of the tropical humid forests. Its name comes from the Quichua language and is constructed by two words: Aya and Huasca. Aya means energy, ancestor and spirit. Huasca means: liana, cord, vine. Ayahuasca is the liana that contains the energy of the ancestral spirit. It is a fundamental food given to us by our Grandmother Cosmos and our Mother Earth, which becomes a privileged medicine to find our own curing and the suitable knowledge to manage a new era. The sacred and medicinal use of Ayahuasca is thousands of years old. There are lots of testimonies of treatments of various types of cancer, AIDS, digestive hepatitis and gastritis. It purifies the blood, the vital organs and increases the vital energy. It cures mental and spiritual disorders. It is an excellent medicine to cure alcoholism, addiction to tobacco and to drugs. Whereas it produces a direct confrontation with inadequate ways of life, it is a very good medicine to be used in healing therapies related to individual, cultural, social and family life.

Ayahuasca causes states of superb mental, spiritual and physical concentration and relaxation, which allows the development of aptitudes and attitudes related to the intellect, the body and the artistic talents. At the same time it increases the cerebral activity of the right hemisphere facilitating higher levels of perception and artistic and aesthetic sensitivity; it is harmonizing the left and right sides of the brain, which repels in a harmonization of our physical, mental and spiritual life.

With much love and ayahuasca

Andy xx

Join me in Peru to celebrate December 21st 2012 - Visit: http://2012awakeningretreat.com/

9 (edited by lyra 2005-02-26 15:05:45)

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

Ayahuasca wrote:

But if you mean has anyone benefitted from taking any kind of hallucinogens then I would say YES, YES and thrice YES.

No, I meant the man-made, laboratory manufactured variety, such as acid, LSD, e, etc.  The kind that give people trips, good feelings, etc...but which also damage the brain.


Ayahuasca wrote:

  If you ever went to Brazil with Heart of the Initiate then you would see for yourself how people can benefit.

I know.  You talk about this a lot.  But that's not what the article or my post was referring to.  The article you posted mentioned specifically, LSD, Timothy Leary, the 60's hallucinogenic drug culture, etc.   It wasn't talking about "The Heart of the Initiate" Group.   I mean, I did not see that mentioned anywhere in the article......unless I'm missing something here.....???     But this is why I mentioned a couple of offhand experiences I know of regarding people in my life who've done LSD / acid......because that's what your article was about.   

To be honest, I am highly skeptical of the idea of using laboratory LSD and other man made hallucinogenics as healing medicinal tools.    I have always had an aversion to it.   Never had any desire to go there, despite the opportunities.    I think I'll listen to my intuition.  It's always right.

As far as shrooms, Ayahuasca, Peyote, and all naturally occurring plants which have hallucinogenic qualities, I wasn't referring to them, so I should have been more specific in that regard.  I was trying to pound out that post just before heading off to work.  wink   So, stuff wasn't clarified.



Ayahuasca wrote:

The one thing that I generally find annoying about the people who speak loudly against the use of hallucinogens is that in nearly every case they know almost nothing about the subject. They've done no real research, not read any books and certainly never taken them for themselves.

As usual, it seems you're defending Ayahuasca, The Heart of the Initiate Group, and the stuff you usually talk about.  I'm not referring to that.    My post was in regards to the *article that you posted.*    So please see above clarification.


Ayahuasca wrote:

I don't mean to criticize you Lyra, but if you had read ANYTHING of any substance on this subject you would never ever have to ask the question "Can anybody claim they have benefitted from it?" The fact that you have to ask that question says that you know virtually nothing about the subject.

Please see above clarification.   And chill.   


Ayahuasca wrote:

I've recommended several books on the subject in several threads now and I'm willing to bet that nobody here has gone out and looked for them. Has anybody even read "Food of the Gods" yet which you can download for free from my directory of the Noble Realms file area?

Probably not.  wink   

At any rate, the article you posted was about LSD and other man-made hallucinogens, with only a small mention / focus on peyote, shrooms and Ayahuasca, and yet you've managed to -- once again --  crank out a post that's very defensive and in regards to *The Heart of the Initiate Group* and Aya.   

My post, and others here were in regards to what that article was about....................LSD and man-made laboratory drugs.....NOT "The Heart of the Intiate Group", Brazil, etc.   So how did it all of a sudden become about that?     ???   

Just wondering.

"Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "Holy shit ... what a ride!"  - Anonymous
-----
"I get by with a little help from my (higher density) friends."
-----

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

lyra wrote:

My post, and others here were in regards to what that article was about....................LSD and man-made laboratory drugs.....NOT "The Heart of the Intiate Group", Brazil, etc.   So how did it all of a sudden become about that?     ???   

Just wondering.

Oh dear, You didn't read the full article did you Lyra?

If you go back and actually READ it you will see references to LSD, Ayahuasca, psilocybin(mushrooms), Peyote, DMT, Ketamine, Iboga and MDMA.

The article also talks about people taking hallucinogens in a religious setting.

Can you see now why I thought you might have been talking about more than acid?

Andy xx

Join me in Peru to celebrate December 21st 2012 - Visit: http://2012awakeningretreat.com/

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

This post sort of relates to the "natural" plants used by the Amazonian tribes.  An older movie titled "The Emerald Forest" (or Emerald Forest).  I believe it was made sometime in the 80's.  It is about a boy that was abducted by a tribe (kidnapped) and the fathers quest to find him once again.  A natural substance was inserted into a tube sort of thing, and blown into the receivers nose.  This substance was used for assistance with the "dreamtime" experience.  Pretty intense and interesting I might say.  Dunno if you can rent the movie, but I went ahead and bought it anyway.  It is based on a TRUE story, with only adds to the excitement.

If there is no time
      Then you have time for everything.
   You're never in a hurry.
That's true freedom.

12 (edited by lyra 2005-02-26 15:43:15)

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

Ayahuasca wrote:
lyra wrote:

My post, and others here were in regards to what that article was about....................LSD and man-made laboratory drugs.....NOT "The Heart of the Intiate Group", Brazil, etc.   So how did it all of a sudden become about that?     ???   

Just wondering.

Oh dear, You didn't read the full article did you Lyra?

If you go back and actually READ it you will see references to LSD, Ayahuasca, psilocybin(mushrooms), Peyote, DMT, Ketamine, Iboga and MDMA.

Andy....I know that.     I wrote:

"At any rate, the article you posted was about LSD and other man-made hallucinogens, with only a small mention / focus on peyote, shrooms and Ayahuasca,......."etc.

So I was aware that the article mentioned those natural hallucinogins, as well as the man made lab drugs, and I made sure to make mention of that.   The focus on the article however, seemed to be on the lab drugs, so, my comments were in regards to that.

At any rate, I'm not trying to fight, or have a pissing contest with anybody.

"Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "Holy shit ... what a ride!"  - Anonymous
-----
"I get by with a little help from my (higher density) friends."
-----

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

zonabi wrote:

All you do, in reality, is replace a belief-system with another

but, isnt this what you would be doing even without the drugs, as you begin to realize and "deprogram/decondition" yourself from the system thats enforced on us here? sounds like a pretty broad generalization.

that's what the "you create your own reality" / "there is no reality" / "select your preferred reality" folks want you to believe. i was following this belief-system a few years ago, it kept me endlessly confused about what was real and paralyzed me in my life path. the goal is to come back to our true nature.

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

What I think most people here are forgetting is that there are generally two types of people who use hallucinogens. There are recreational users, with no spiritual leanings, who have no respect for the drugs and it's THESE people who end up frying their brains eventually. Then there are intelligent/spiritual users, who educate themselves and understand what they are doing, and have total respect for the plants and their spirit. Rarely do these people ever do any damage to themselves.

i wish the difference was that clear-cut. the large majority of "spiritual seekers" are only looking for ego-pleasure.

I don't mean to criticize you Lyra, but if you had read ANYTHING of any substance on this subject you would never ever have to ask the question "Can anybody claim they have benefitted from it?" The fact that you have to ask that question says that you know virtually nothing about the subject.

again i wish it was that easy. what is healing anyway? some occult techniques, for example, can make you feel very good, can apparently "solve" lifelong physical, emotional and mental problems, but they end up trapping your soul in even deeper illusions, so in the end they only harm you. lyra's question is more than valid.

I've recommended several books on the subject in several threads now and I'm willing to bet that nobody here has gone out and looked for them. Has anybody even read "Food of the Gods" yet which you can download for free from my directory of the Noble Realms file area?

i've partly read some of these books. they are all pretty much the same, words salad but with very few down-to-earth applications. some of these authors are hopelessly delusional about their "spiritual experiences".

For about 3 or 4 hours I had this absolutely incredible loving force of energy blasting through every cell in my body. And it was wonderful! And it changed everything - for the better!

sigh. that's the kind of "peak experiences" our culture is addicted to.

Ultimately Ayahuasca's most important lesson is about love. If there's one common theme running through most peoples descriptions of their ayahuasca experiences, it's love. Not love as some intellectual concept, but love as a force that is absolutely real, and that is ultimately behind everything in this universe.

then how come that it is extensively used by freemasons in south america?

Re: Psychedelic medicine: Mind bending, health giving

Hmmm. This I had not heard. You've got me curious now, erm. What else do you know about this mason use of ayahuasca? That really throws a new angle in, eh?