Topic: Life after Death?

Hi guys!  I haven't been around much lately, but it looks like the forum is booming these days.  Great to see.

I've been thinking about the short amount of time we have on this planet.  In some ways, it's hard for me to even process the fact that one day I will cease to exist, at least in this form.  The idea that I exist at all is often times so mind-blowing that I can't even wrap my head around it.

I guess what I'm wondering is: what does everyone here think happens after death?  What are your opinions/reasons for thinking/knowing so? If we move on to the 4th density after death, is there a "heaven"? 

Curious to see what you guys and gals have to say on the matter.

"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly;
what is essential is invisible to the eye."
-Antoine de Saint-Exupery

2 (edited by wandering1 2004-08-17 21:33:42)

Re: Life after Death?

I recognize that many people may have ideas about life after death.  The folowing text is for people who are interested in considering various possibilities with an open mind.  If you already have a set of understandings about life after death and you feel that it is not proper to examine your set of understandings, or if you don't want to examine your understandings, then I suggest not reading the following text.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I think that the book "Journey of Souls" by Michael Newton is a good resource on this topic.  He has used hypnosis with many people to explore the area of life after death.   I am using that source plus many others in order to suggest the following situation. The picture that emerges is that after death the individual, the soul, goes to to what might be termed a "rest area".  This area could be considered "heaven", in some systems (Ra, C's), it is called 5th density. 

In 5th density a review of the life takes place.  There is plenty of opportunity for study and rest.  Eventually, the soul is ready for a greater challenge in order to continue in its evolution and in consultation with the soul's guides, the soul chooses the outlines of its next life.  The density level and parameters of the life are related to what the soul is ready for.

Generally, the soul goes right to the resting place after death.  In some cases, such as if the death is traumatic , the soul gets stuck and does not make it back to its resting place right away.  This may result in disembodied spirits or ghosts.

After many incarnations, we learn many lessons, and come to understand what we truly are.  What we truly are seems to be the oneness.  So it seems that each of us is god in disguise, playing a game of hide and seek in order to experience the infinite possibilities of the universe.

3 (edited by ehhnus 2004-08-18 11:14:04)

Re: Life after Death?

I see.  That's not the first time I've heard this theory as a possibility.  Sylvia Browne has written about this in depth, as a matter of fact. (I know, some take her and some leave her.)

I guess I'm having a hard time conveying what I really want to know.  When I relax, the question comes to me, but as soon as I try and mentally grab it, it's blocked.  Instead, I'll try and ask what I want to by using a bunch of questions.  Bear with me.

What is God?  I realize that we are all a part of God, according to this theory, but is God a child, sort of, trying to learn?

If God is trying to learn and evolve, what is God aiming to evolve into? 

Are there more than one "Gods" going through this process?

What is the Universe?  Better yet, WHY is there a Universe at all?  How did it get here?

What is existence at all?  WHY is there existence?  DOES GOD HAVE A GOD? 

Even if we are all a part of God, which I suspect we are,  where did we come from?  What was first?  Is there even a first or a last?  What are we moving towards as souls, as God, and as members of this Universe?

Is there more than one Universe?  What does that mean for us?

Those are some of the questions that I've been grappling with.  While I know that physical death is inevitable, I still want to know what direction I'm going in and the meaning of it all.  While I know that no one has all the answers, I would appreciate any input.

Thanks guys.

"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly;
what is essential is invisible to the eye."
-Antoine de Saint-Exupery

4 (edited by wandering1 2004-08-18 12:07:16)

Re: Life after Death?

Those are good questions.  You've asked what I consider to be some of the deepest questions out there.

I think that God (the oneness) has created existence in order to experience a range of possibilities.  I think that the range is infinite and beyond time.

I think that all of your questions are valid.  I will suggest another approach.  While we can have long discussions about these topics, try to think of these questions as coming from the mind.  Perhaps think of them as coming from an intellectual center.

How would your heart respond if asked the same questions?  What is the feeling tone that you get?

I think that the time may be coming within 10 years when there is a knowingness that includes both heart and mind that fills us up.  We will be able to transcend many of the questions that currently baffle us.

Does God have a God?  I like that one!  I suggest this possibility.  Ultimately, if it is really God, then God the oneness does not have another oneness. 

However, I can see the possibility that a whole universe comes to completion and every being in that universe understands fully in a body-mind-spirit way that it is the oneness of the universe.

In Bringers of the Dawn, this event is mentioned.  The higher density beings say that they came from a universe that completed itself and then they go to other universes to help them complete themselves.  Whenever there is a lack of oneness, then there is the possibility for suffering.  Once you have transcended suffering yourself, you don't want others to suffer so you go off in search of suffering in order to help people see and experience the bigger picture.

Just some thoughts!

Re: Life after Death?

ehhnus and wandering1,

Awesome words wandering1, and I agree with you that they are the deepest questions out there, as well as in our hearts and minds.  I especially liked it ehhnus when you asked "...is God a child...", now that's an interesting perspective.  And while I certainly can't claim to actually know your frustration level ehhnus, I can feel the frustration behind "WHAT/WHY is a Universe?" just like it's my own frustration I've been so familiar with. 

It's funny because even though I haven't a clue one what a universe is, why or how it got here, I still have this pretty rock solid belief that there are multiple universes... HA! Now what kind of discernment is that?

I have two comments to this question--

ehhnus wrote:

What is God?

Goddess. big_smile

and,

When I quieted myself and seriously posed this question to myself the first words that came to my mind were "God is liberty", yet who else is going to understand that in that moment I found god to be synonymous with liberty.  And it still doesn't explain what god is, now does it? 

I think the answers to these questions are best when they take a form we can be comfortable with as an individual, regardless of our parents, siblings, friends, neighbors, leaders, expectations of what to believe about God, existence, the Universe... we can't think of these questions' answers in terms of what's right or wrong (not that it was suggested to do so), but rather better to think in terms of what we can live with in our individual hearts and minds, and that what beliefs we do adopt allow for growth... and lots of it.  And as well, I've found it's not best to become too comfy in even my own day to day "safety-net" belief systems, because those can and have been challenged and have taken a different shape in the blink of an eye.

Honestly ehhnus, my heart goes out to you, your questions are honest and genuine, and your drive to understand "it all" is admirable. For myself, wondering and wondering about your exact questions, in the past, got to be counterproductive, I just finally had to tell myself, "Just decide on SOMETHING or let it all go", and so I did.

Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.
------
Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we're here we might as well dance.
------
If you spin around on your chair really fast, things around here will make a lot more sense.

lol

6 (edited by cameron 2004-08-18 17:59:02)

Re: Life after Death?

Hi Ennus (pronounced, "N-Us", for others), welcome back.

Montalk's written a few intriguing documents exploring these "nature of reality" concepts.  Looking at the new site however, the one article I'd quote isn't available (yet). 

Hey Montalk - might you post you're article here?  The one about "key concepts" or "fundamental concepts" as I remember it?

Re: Life after Death?

Sure thing, Cameron. I haven't put it on the new site because I thought the intros to the sections sufficed. But it wouldn't hurt to post it anyway under the "about" section, with some revisions. Here is the unrevised version, feel free to quote what you need.

Key Concepts wrote:

God

-- source of all creation

-- without personality or gender

-- projects two aspects of itself: pure individuated consciousness, and matter/energy

-- infuses matter/energy with fragments of its own consciousness

-- goal is to allow individuated fragments to expand via learning until they unite with the whole

-- does not diminish in size when a fragment is created...the process is holographic replication

-- also called Creator, Prime Creator, Alpha Node, Superphoton, and Source

Soul

-- individual holographic fragment of God

-- possesses self-awareness, or individual-consciousness

-- mineral, plant, animal, and human souls differ in complexity and level of individuality

-- in higher planes of reality, souls may exist without a physical body

-- while in physical body, the quality of the body (genetics) must match quality of soul (soul frequency)

-- large mismatches in genetics and soul frequency result in failure to incarnate properly

-- slight mismatches cause gradual mutations in one to accommodate the other

-- human soul is composed of astral (emotional), etheric (life-force), and mental (conscious) components.

Humans

-- the human body is a generic machine with various natural and artificial genetic variations having produced the various racial types

-- unique genetics allow great diversity and potential for growth of the inhabiting soul

-- one particular unique genetic characteristic allows direct energetic link to the Creator

-- the human race, while uniform in physical shape, includes many different types of souls

-- origins of souls in human bodies include native human, alien, animal group-souls, or artificial/nonexistent soul.

-- various races were artificially created by the tweaking of an original human template by alien races

Aliens

-- originate from other planets, dimensions, parallel realities, and times

-- are divided into positive, negative, and neutral factions

-- each alien race is composed of a mixed bag of factions of varying intentions

-- reside underground, on the moon and other planets, in space, underwater, and in higher levels of reality

-- have human counterparts, which are these alien souls incarnated in genetically tweaked human bodies

-- except for native humans, whose parent alien race is ancient and nonphysical, most alien-soul humans tend to be abducted by factions from their associated race of aliens

-- these abductees also tend to be abducted by other alien factions, usually negative, who do NOT share their soul origin

-- main negative groups at present are factions within the Gray and Reptilian races

-- Grays (in general) use humans as genetic stock to build a new hybrid race for incarnation

-- Reptilians want humans as a natural physical and spiritual resource.

Evolution

-- physical evolution is due to natural selection, random mutation, conscious selection, and conscious mutation

-- human evolution is mostly artificial; either DNA mutates to conform to alien soul frequency, or else DNA is artificially altered through advanced genetic engineering by certain alien factions

-- because body must match soul, the death of a species means loss of compatible bodies for purposes of reincarnation. Thus physical life seeks physical survival and propagation of genes.

-- the purpose of physical evolution is to accommodate and serve spiritual evolution

-- spiritual evolution is the accumulation of individuality, self-awareness, and knowledge by the soul

Morality

-- all that encourages spiritual evolution is called positive, all that hinders it is called negative

-- what causes pain and is self-serving is called "evil," what is loving and altruistic is called "good"

-- good and evil are subjective and relative, but positive and negative are objective and absolute

-- proper balance between good and evil forces results in positivity

-- too much good leads to stagnation, too much evil leads to total destruction

-- balance is maintained by having both in proper ratio and diametric opposition

-- one who fights solely for good or evil is a fool, one who fights strictly for positivity is a noble warrior

-- such a warrior will incorporate the proper balance of good/evil within himself, then seek to restore balance to negative systems

Freewill

-- some beings have more freewill than others

-- the more consciousness, self-awareness, or spiritual evolution one possesses, the greater one's freewill

-- possession of freewill is useless until it is applied

-- beings with freewill can be coerced into behaving as though they have none

-- knowledge allows these deceived beings to regain the full use of their former freewill

-- humans in general are beings with enormous amounts of freewill

-- negative alien factions have instated a control system to trick humans into limiting their own freewill

-- negative alien factions possess less freewill than humans, thus their reliance upon technology and subtle coercion as a form of spiritual jujitsu to overcome a spiritually greater opponent

-- beings with actively utilized higher levels of freewill, can override the actions, thoughts, and realities of beings with lower levels of freewill

-- beings with lower freewill, either directly or indirectly serve beings of higher freewill

-- physicality allows the violation of freewill between physical beings, the main reason why physical existence is a valuable experience in the path of spiritual evolution

Reality

-- reality has multiple timelines, dimensions, and planes of existence including physical, astral, and etheric

-- physical reality is generated by a base level consciousness (BLC) whose behavior is described by the laws of physics

-- BLC is the soul of the physical universe, though without independent sentient consciousness, freewill, or creativity

-- BLC provides the matter and energy for physical bodies into which independent consciousness (souls) incarnate

-- Entropy, logic, mathematics, rigidity, substance (instead of form), and linear time are keywords associated with the BLC

-- the BLC is not God; it's merely half of God, the other half being individual consciousness

-- if a tree falls in a forest and no one is there to hear it, it still makes a sound because BLC universally upholds the laws of physics whether a soul is around or not

Physics

--the speed of light is how fast finite consciousness propagates through linear space

--all of physical reality from beginning to end, in all its possible manifestations, was instantly created with the Big Bang

--from this web of possibilities, at each moment an individual consciousness chooses which possibility to experience next

--this choice is restricted by the BLC and opposing freewill of other beings

--there are three dimensions of time: linear time, phase time, and spiritual time

--linear time is our conscious record of events, phase time is the distance between parallel timelines, and spiritual time measures progress along the axis of spiritual evolution

--physical reality as we know it moves forward in linear time and is entropic

--from a linear perspective, individual consciousness originates from the end of the universe (when matter is totally unified with consciousness) and propagates backward in linear time, and is negentropic

--when individual consciousness is coupled to physical reality, it experiences forward linear time

--when coupled to an astral, etheric, or higher dimensional body, time becomes nonlinear

--when coupled to no body, time becomes nonexistent and the soul unites with its Source

New World Order

-- NWO is a compartmentalized political entity seeking to subjugate humanity under a hostile alien agenda

-- the NWO hierarchy is composed from the bottom up of negative factions of law enforcement and military, politicians, bankers, secret societies, aliens, and demonic beings from the lower astral planes

-- the current goal is to politically unite humanity into a global nation so that there is nowhere to run or hide from totalitarianism

-- this unification will be accomplished by rigged threats to humanity such as terrorism, nuclear war, planetary cataclysms, or alien invasions

-- America is the NWO's biggest threat due to her gun culture and libertarian foundations. The American government is the seat of the NWO.

Religion

-- there is no religion higher than truth

-- most organized religions are control systems to mentally and spiritually enslave humans and deprive them of freewill

-- most religions have alien origins, or else are corrupted by negative alien factions and their human counterparts who seek control over the masses

-- any religion demanding its followers pray or focus on a deity outside themselves is aiding in the transdimensional economy of spiritual energy robbery and consumption by nonphysical beings

-- many religions were created specifically by the parent alien race to be followed by their human counterpart race

-- faith should only be used for yet-unknowable, not dogmatically ignored, phenomena

-- church is unnecessary as an aid to spiritual evolution and only acts as a social institution for social programming purposes

-- direct gnostic communion with one's inner guidance (God) is more valuable than any religion

Matrix

-- the matrix is a metaphysical control system used to manipulate humanity via artificial synchronicity

-- a synchronicity is a meaningful coincidence, or something that appears accidental but has a hidden purpose

-- the matrix's main purpose is to extract spiritual energy from humans by subjecting them to emotionally draining melodramas

-- it is a tool used by spiritually inferior beings to subliminally control spiritually superior humans

-- it is built and maintained by negative hyperdimensional beings who require this energy for survival

-- in more general terms, the matrix is the invisible control system around us which manipulates our minds, emotions, and actions without us noticing it

-- it uses a variety of human agents to accomplish its job

-- anyone who lacks a soul or individuality is a prime Matrix agent

-- these agents, because they are directed by the Matrix, exhibit hive-mind behavior

-- the Matrix interfaces with the underlying "machine code" of our reality, and can manipulate certain aspects of our timeline

-- the matrix is a rigid, mechanical, and pseudo-conscious machine that must crunch data about our habits, emotional patterns, and present behavior in order to synchronistically insert an appropriate event in our life for effective control

-- because we are more conscious than the matrix, we can overcome it; it's a matter of regaining and exercising our freewill through knowledge

Acquiring fringe knowledge is like digging for diamonds in a mine field.

Re: Life after Death?

Super.  (a nice thought-ball, BTW)

Anything peak your interest, Ennus?

Re: Life after Death?

ehhnus wrote:

I guess what I'm wondering is: what does everyone here think happens after death?  What are your opinions/reasons for thinking/knowing so? If we move on to the 4th density after death, is there a "heaven"?

ehnus,
Well it's late and I haven't read the rest of the posts but your question is one I've thought about for quite some time. I've come to the conclusion that the idea that organized religion beats into your head about only having one chance for "heaven" is ludicrous. Think about it for a second, the universe has been around for about what, 11-12 billion years? The earth for 4 billion, mankind itself (according to the church) for about 5000? Now, out of all that time a human lifespan of 70 years is less than the blink of an eye and if god forbid you screw it up you're damned to hell for all eternity.

Pfffttt, stuff and nonsense.. What about babies who never really get a chance to do anything? What about little children who are abused and killed before they even comphrehend they have fingers and toes? What if that one crazy guy in the corner is the only one who's got it right and the rest of us are all damed to hell?

In my opinion reincarnation is the only thing that makes any sense at all. Try, try and try again till you learn your lessons. Then try something harder.

Saracen

"We will not go quietly into the night, We will not give up without a fight...."

10

Re: Life after Death?

I was raised a Frisbeetarian. They believe that when you die, your soul goes up on the roof and you can't get it down.

Re: Life after Death?

Auendove wrote:

Goddess:D

Thanks for making me laugh out loud.  That was very cute. smile

Montalk wrote:

-- while in physical body, the quality of the body (genetics) must match quality of soul (soul frequency)

When you say this, does this deal with physical appearance or physical condition, or both?  Would someone with poor health have a soul of a lower frequency, or am I way off?  Does it have to do with the race of the alien soul within us?

Having asked that, can you tell what alien race or mix of races a person is by their physical appearance? Does the sex a person is have anything to do with the soul, or is that something selected BY the soul in order to experience things exclusive to a male or female?

Montalk wrote:

-- except for native humans, whose parent alien race is ancient and nonphysical, most alien-soul humans tend to be abducted by factions from their associated race of aliens

How interesting.  What do we know about this ancient and nonphysical race?  I would love to learn more about it, and why/ how native humans ended up here in the first place.  Where would be a good place to start learning about this?

Montalk wrote:

-- there is no religion higher than truth

I've felt this to be true for a while now.  I use this argument frequently when trying to convince my worried mother that I'm not going to hell.  And it works- temporarily. wink

Montalk wrote:

--all of physical reality from beginning to end, in all its possible manifestations, was instantly created with the Big Bang

So would we say that God created the Big Bang, or is it the other way around?

Thanks for your responses, everyone.  It's always nice to know that other people can empathize with my questions and confusion. smile

"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly;
what is essential is invisible to the eye."
-Antoine de Saint-Exupery

12 (edited by Auendove 2004-08-19 16:47:19)

Re: Life after Death?

ehhnus wrote:

Thanks for making me laugh out loud.  That was very cute. smile

It is my pleasure to serve. big_smile  Sometimes I think the only thing that keeps me clinging to life is to see just how many people I can make laugh!

On a more somber note (sorry, but I just want to write this here, get it off my chest, and then let go of it, especially since you notated the Goddess comment), I was speaking on the telephone with my mom this morning and made an off the cuff statement saying, "Oh dear Goddess..." and my mother came unglued. She told me I'm going to Hell, and how disrespectful I am to God for calling him Goddess... uhhh, with a really nasty tone in her voice.  I told her I don't believe in Hell, and she started crying.  I made my mother cry because I don't believe in something as obnoxious as Hell. I wasn't being mean to her at all, in fact I was trying to be vewee, vewee careful, but I amend my beliefs for no one.... I shouldn't have to.  I guess they don't teach the paritioners at my mother's church about the Law of Allowance.  And my mate wonders why I don't like to talk to my mom more often...

There, I'm finished.

EDIT--Organized religion sucks! :x... maybe now I can let go of it.

Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.
------
Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we're here we might as well dance.
------
If you spin around on your chair really fast, things around here will make a lot more sense.

lol

Re: Life after Death?

arronfirebrand wrote:

I was raised a Frisbeetarian. They believe that when you die, your soul goes up on the roof and you can't get it down.

May Goddess bless you 100 times over Brother/Man.... this time I needed a good laugh, and got it I did. Thanks!

Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.
------
Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we're here we might as well dance.
------
If you spin around on your chair really fast, things around here will make a lot more sense.

lol

Re: Life after Death?

Maybe God is Everywhere.

Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.
------
Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we're here we might as well dance.
------
If you spin around on your chair really fast, things around here will make a lot more sense.

lol

15

Re: Life after Death?

I can't take credit for that bit, Auendove. Jim Stafford used it on an old Smothers Brothers show and it stuck with me. I usually offer it when religion is being discussed. It's hard for me to seriously consider any religion, but there are certainly profound truths to be found in some of the basic documents pertaining. Joining a religion is essentially taking an oath of allegiance to its doctrines, and an oath of rejection for anything outside its teaching. Seek the Truth and you'll find yourself walking out of church (or being put out).
     But I gotta ask, why would an entity powerful enough to set creation in motion be associated with either human sex? It seems to me that a Creator would have no need to physically reproduce and would be beyond a human notion of sexual identity. "God" and "Goddess" are both inappropriate names. And No One here knows the True Name of the Creator anyway. Just pick an androgynous name like Pat or Chris and use that!
     "I hope your god has mercy on mine" --Matthew Ryan