1 (edited by joeman 2007-10-04 15:38:15)

Topic: My thought about music

I will give you the reason why I stopped listening to music, and you can tell me if I am insane.

Music today is a lot different from the pre-industrial era.  Back then only the fortunate ones get to listen to music in a concert, and there is almost no other way to listen to music the way we do.  Maybe during a mass in a church but that's about it.  Normally the way music enters a person's live is when amature performs in places such as a pub or privately or whatever.  But it is still a lot different from listening to CD today.

Today music is almost used as a tool for mind control.  Let me explain.

Michael Tsarion said ego consciousness is recent phenomenon.  It is a biological reaction from the phyche trauma humans endured when we are spliced with the alien genes. 

Before that happened, we used to be able to tap into some sort of universal consciousness, our true self, just like Plato said humans learn not from seeking new knowledge but from recollection.  Plato said humans already possess all knowledge.

Right now ego consciousness simply enslaves our mind.  When we end this enslavement, our truth self will emerge.  In order for that to happen, we need to stop fueling our ego. 

But music today creates a big groove in our subconsciousness that your can't help but let your ego consciousness picks it up and add fuel to it.  It is almost similar to how addiction works.  When I meditate, the only noise I get is music that is running in my head.  When you meditate, you don't actually try to end all thinking.  Because if you do, you are still fueling your ego consciousness.  You'll stop thinking because it will happen naturally.  So I have to let the music runs its course until the big groove in my subconsciousness disapear with time. 

I doubt this kind of thing can happen if you listen to your sister plays violin a hundred times.  Your brain respond to that kind of music different from the music that is produced by record company.  Because your ego doesn't like it as much, the groove that is created in your subconscious mind is not as deep. 

I am about to give away all my CD's to my relatives.

I don't know if this makes sense or not.  I find myself more and more ascetic.  I don't do that simply for the sake of being ascetic or following certain religious precept but I do it for specific reasons.

John 10:34

Jesus answered, "Is it not written in your law, 'I said, you are gods'?

2 (edited by Hermit Brad 2007-10-04 16:24:08)

Re: My thought about music

I've observed this in myself as well. Generally, my ego is in check, but whenever I listen to certain music, I cannot contain my ego. It has to do with the ego's craving for drama. When I listen to dramatic or angry music, my ego is stimulated and ego fantasies will roll out using the music as a sort of soundtrack.

"There cannot be progress without expression. There cannot be expression without separation. There cannot be separation without progress."-Ouroboros

3

Re: My thought about music

I agree.  The ego stimulant can be observed in many ways.  I notice the urge to speed in my car while listening to the top hits.  I've given up 90% of the top hits but the addiction for energetic beat is still noticable.  Not to mention the lyrics that are being hammered into the minds of listeners.

Re: My thought about music

The problem isn't identifying these ego stimulants (unless you aren’t privy to knowing yourself) but overcoming the addiction to such things and knowing when to say no and stick to it. I have no problem identifying such things, but giving up something like music that you enjoy, something that keeps you entertained is hard. It's like trying to give up a particular food, quitting smoking, etc.

"There cannot be progress without expression. There cannot be expression without separation. There cannot be separation without progress."-Ouroboros

Re: My thought about music

I only listen to classical music and maybe some jazz, but never
anything with lyrics anymore.  I've picked the music that puts
me in a good space and avoid the hot, angry and depressing
stuff.  My favorites are all on burned cd's which is what I listen
to in the car and at home.

There is some music that can uplift and be a positive factor
if you know how to look for it. 

But even then, you're trading one type of "earworm", a positive
one, for another, and it's still an "earworm" or a tune that gets
into your head and repeats itself.  You can use these as tools
to keep a positive attitude or to motivate you, or to relax.

OR you can play GANGSTA RAP and feel motivated to go
out and prove your stupidity by robbing a liquor store...
You can tell the judge that it was 'cause you was listenin'
to RAP that you went CRAZY.  I'm sure the judge will be
sympathetic...

TP

Re: My thought about music

But I like music.....:|

Re: My thought about music

Tom Paine wrote:

I only listen to classical music and maybe some jazz, but never
anything with lyrics anymore.  I've picked the music that puts
me in a good space and avoid the hot, angry and depressing
stuff.  My favorites are all on burned cd's which is what I listen
to in the car and at home.

There is some music that can uplift and be a positive factor
if you know how to look for it. 

But even then, you're trading one type of "earworm", a positive
one, for another, and it's still an "earworm" or a tune that gets
into your head and repeats itself.  You can use these as tools
to keep a positive attitude or to motivate you, or to relax.

OR you can play GANGSTA RAP and feel motivated to go
out and prove your stupidity by robbing a liquor store...
You can tell the judge that it was 'cause you was listenin'
to RAP that you went CRAZY.  I'm sure the judge will be
sympathetic...

TP

I'm sorry but that statement there is dumb. Music is not going to make you do something like shoot people or pimp slap a ho. Unless you are real stupid.:rolleyes:

8 (edited by fr0gdance7 2007-10-04 23:21:12)

Re: My thought about music

I have a hard time understanding the gist of the post. Are you saying that music is a form of mind-control? Granted, alot of music today sucks big time, but some is actually really good. Unfortunately alot of music which "I" think is good is sort of underground and isn't stuff that is played on the radio or in mainstream media.

None of this should be a reason for you to stop listening to music altogether, to me...that's like stop going to museums or art galleries, stop reading, don't go to any films, operas, plays, don't talk or laugh or have any sort of creative outlet whatsoever.

Can music be an addiction? Sure! I mean...i love music! I travelled across states to see one particular band in my teens. And today, i don't go anywhere without my Iriver. I listen to it when i go to work, at work, when i'm home relaxing. I sing music when i'm in my shower, washing dishes, vacuuming, lol! I play music on my piano every chance i get! I love to meditate and listen to music, at least once a day. Perhaps i'm addicted to that as well?

Listen....I think there's alot of crap out there, but there's alot of new music that is really good. But in general music shouldn't be seen as a drug, it just happens to make you happy and often times at peace. Dont disregard it because of that. And certaintly don't make judgements on people who DO listen to music that doesn't fit your needs.

Oh and by the way, I also listen to alot of "gangsta" rap and I love it....I haven't killed anyone or robbed any banks. wink

<<OR you can play GANGSTA RAP and feel motivated to go
out and prove your stupidity by robbing a liquor store...
You can tell the judge that it was 'cause you was listenin'
to RAP that you went CRAZY.  I'm sure the judge will be
sympathetic...>>

Re: My thought about music

If you think I am advocating that you should stop listening to certain types of music because it's crap.  You're completely missing the point.  It was talking about what commercial music is doing to your subconscious mind in general.  The fact that there are good music out there is completely irrelavent.

John 10:34

Jesus answered, "Is it not written in your law, 'I said, you are gods'?

Re: My thought about music

It all has to do with a rearrangement of our faculties of perception.  I believe it's possible to shift things back mentally.  It may be that receiving information by the ego was a byproduct of hybridization but maybe it's more a product of domestication programming which was instituted by these predators.  Some of you remember that I realized an actual change in mental function by mentally placing myself outside my own identity but I had no idea what I was actually doing until I read The Four Agreements.  By not taking anything personally I was freeing myself from control by ego and emotional juice (to which most are addicted, i.e., drama).  When we do that we become more aware of what we're thinking, saying, and doing.  And we begin to seperate from the automatic responses to domestication programming.  And we begin to experience from the heart instead of the head.  Then M5 recommended the fantastic book, The Secret Teachings of Plants: The Intelligence of the Heart in the Direct Perception of Nature, and everything came together.  I could see where we'd been and how we got to where we are now.  The book details techniques for regaining this lost method of perceiving the world around us.  This is the difference between knowledge and wisdom; one is imposed by programming, the other experienced and "learned" directly by the heart intuitively.  What is in the heart is integrity, truth, the true human.  What is in the head may all be lies, and only the heart can tell the difference.


http://www.redwingbooks.com/products/bo … TeaPla.cfm

11 (edited by nexus 2007-10-08 05:32:51)

Re: My thought about music

By posting this thread in the spirituality and metaphysics section i think it's in the right place.  I understand you completely on this joeman.  I believe your developing aversion to modern music is the awakening of your soul's knowing that most of it  is not native to your soul vibration.  You're losing your appetite for another of the world's dubious pleasures.

Anyone who is remotely interested in their spiritual health might want to consider the various effects of music on the body, the psyche and the spirit.   It is not enough to say  " I like music,  so it has to be good for me."  Some men like to drink two bottles of gin before beating their wives too but it's not much good.  But i'm not saying music is no good.   I am saying that some music is inherently harmful.    So it's more than personal taste which should govern our affections and appetites for anything, including music, especially before we have developed spiritual discernment.  Knowlege is power and in that spirit i offer this for anyone to take or leave...

Most people have read the old quote from that old control freak, grand daddy Rothschild... " i care not who makes the laws of the nation but let me create the credit."

Well there is another quote of about the same vintage by [ sorry i forget who]...  " I care not who makes the laws but let me make the music."

Both of these quotes were spoken by people who understood the immense power both had to mold the individual consciousness of the masses.

We now understand the power of credit to control the masses but not too many people think twice about the music we are exposed to except to decide whether we like a particular musical style or song or whether we don't.  Same with food.  If we are drunk enough even Mcdonalds fries will taste great.   If we are intoxicated enough on ego- consciousness even the [ozzy] Osbournes will sound great.  That's a fair analogy because most modern music, rock, [c]rap, jazz etc... appeals to the lower- ego.   But it's not just the sentiment expressed in the lyrics.  It's the music.  What's wrong with the music man?   From a spiritual perspective,  almost everything is wrong with it.

It is said that music moves the soul.  That is true of some music like a lot of the classicals and ancient folk songs ... and a few bits and pieces of modern music.   But today most of it moves the ego,  especially since the voodoo rythym made it's way first into the precursors of jazz and then through that into rock n roll and all of it's derivatives since.   Consider all the dis-chord inherent in a lot of the popular music and all of the wailing woe in the vocals.   None of this originates in the soul or inner- spirit.   It is born out of the self- love, self- pity and agression of the human consciousness and is therefore spiritless.  It can only appeal to the same elements of the human consciousness in the audience.   [Black] 'artist' and audience are one in group hysteria not in spirit.   But why does it feel so good?   Why does everything 'good' have to be bad for you?   For the spiritual aspirant modern rock/pop, [c]rap etc is poison.  Think 'the serpent in the garden offering you a beautiful fruit'. 

"Nexus you liar!   Put nexus to death for his blasphemy!   Give us Motley Crue and black sabbath!  Give us Megadeath, the Killers, Gorilaz and Jet!    And crucify nexus!   Liar!"       Look settle down.... don't get carried away i'll explain to you what else is wrong with the music.   It's really not much else.... honest.  cool

It's just that other 'inconsequential'  part of your favourite songs...  the rhythm and beat.   

"aaah! ...hoist nexus by his own petard!  This can't be true!"

If a human being was flesh only then it wouldn't be true and rock music wouldn't matter.  But we are soul and spirit.  Our native abode is in spiritual planes yet our spiritual nature is incarnate in this plane of matter.   The AllGod has placed 7 major spiritual centers along the spine of each of us [the 7 virgins].  The spiritual light is anchored at the etheric level in each chakra and the flow of that energy can be unlocked through devotion, prayer, meditation and service.   In these ways, the affirmation of the real self [the inner christ consciousness] causes the light of love to appear in our lives.   The dark powers have for aeons devised methods to fool and trick people into focusing on the external consciousness and to ignite self love  pride and agression.    Anything to keep us from our first love.  Many of these fallen beings were once cast into the earth having great knowlege of universal laws.  They knew the science of sound because the great Spirit framed the worlds by the power of sound..... The Word.  They knew they could corrupt this world and ourselves by inverting the divine harmony and divine rhythms inherent in nature and in ourselves.

They knew that,  if allowed to flow naturally, the light within us should flow up the spine from the base chakra up to the heart chakra and on up to the crown chakra.  If it does we will be fully enlightened by it.  It says in the bible [something like] " To him that overcometh he shall be given the crown of life."   This refers to the purified crown chakra in the person who succeeds in this process of raising up the [kundalini] light that is locked in the base chakra.   Many people have accomplished this and moved on to spiritual realms but generally this kundalini force is largely dormant in most people on earth.   If we can re- connect with inner- spirit and develop love in the heart this will act as a magnet to draw up the light from the lower chakras.  This is very pertinent to rock music and i will explain what i know.

In the majority of people, the divine light does not rise naturally within because many alluring ways have been devised to cause us to sabotage ourselves in the process.   The fallen beings, themselves cut off from the spiritual source of light, have devised many devious methods to steal that light from us by ensuring that we lose it in the lower chakras before it rises to the heart and crown.  Different kinds of media have been produced to appeal to the human emotional nature [rather than the superior spiritual e- motion] and this is by design.  Rock music and it's derivatives are just some of those media which force energy into motion in a way which misqualifies it in the lower planes.   

Ideally,  The 7 chakras are each activated by unique rhythms which help to unlock the flow of light energy within them.  When i say "unlock" i mean that certain natural rhythms can help us attune to certain chakras [we don't even have to try] and so these rhythms help to cause the energy in the chakras to move and flow from the spiritual and etheric levels,  into our mental, emotional and physical bodies to spiritually energise them.

The base chakra has 4 petals and the 4/4  time corresponds to the base chakra.  It is the foundation of the pyramid.  Naturally,  the 4/4 time has the syncopation on the first beat... ONE 2, 3, 4    ONE 2, 3, 4    ONE 2, 3, 4   ONE 2, 3, 4.  [some of the Indian bhajans have this rhythm]

But the rock beat corrupts the natural 4/4 time.   While it is true that in it's most basic form the rock beat uses 4/4 time [and various close derivatives of the syncopated 4/4 timing]  it has it's syncopation on the third beat instead of the first...  1, 2, THREE 4,   1, 2, THREE, 4,   1, 2, THREE, 4   1, 2, THREE, 4.   It is counteracting the natural rhythm of the base chakra and assaulting the heart in order to oppose it's true manifestation.  As this energy is drawn and inverted in a counter direction to the natural flow it produces a rush.

"Heaven [spiritual light] suffereth violence and the violent take it by force"

The rock beat is an anapestic beat and it is anti- lifeforce in it's effect.  It is actually opposite to the heart beat and the heart chakra which is 3/4 time.  ie.  the natural rhythm of the heart chakra is  ONE, 2, 3    ONE,  2, 3,    ONE, 2, 3.   [many old folk songs and the Strauss waltzes have this rhythm]. 

The voodoo rhythms of Africa were the inspiration for all their modern rhythmic derivatives in America and now the world.   These rhythms force the energy DOWN the spinal altar into the lower chakras where they are expressed with unnatural force, forcing the chakras to turn and release the light energy in negative forms into the astral plane.   As the energy is released it gives a certain exhilaration [like all "good" lifeforce stealing activities do] and so it is greatly enjoyed and greatly desired.  Eventually people feel deflated, as all vampirous activities leave one feeling, and seeking  the same activity for the same high, over and over.

But anyone who is finding 'true north' within, will eventually find that most modern music is pulling against the inner magnet of the soul and spirit.  He/she will find it difficult or near impossible to maintain spiritual attunement in the face of what feels like an external chaotic onslaught tearing at the soul and trying to tear down the light and crack open the subconscious to get access to the old records of angst and agression.... and of course thereby,  the light.

Re: My thought about music

I also wonder about musical scales. If seven notes of the diatonic scale correspond to seven chakras, then would the five notes of the pentatonic scale correspond to only 5 chakras? Modern music depends heavily on the pentatonic scale.

Nexus wrote:

If a human being was flesh only then it wouldn't be true and rock music wouldn't matter.  But we are soul and spirit.  Our native abode is in spiritual planes yet our spiritual nature is incarnate in this plane of matter.   The AllGod has placed 7 major spiritual centers along the spine of each of us [the 7 virgins].

Physical music devoid of soul and spirit -- that summarizes modern popular music. But what about spiritual music devoid of physicality? Could imbalance go both ways? If it fails to stimulate all seven chakras in balance, then it would be unhealthy so long as we have an active physical existence. Ethereal-sounding New Age music or classical adagios may soothe the mind and soul, but in lacking power, energy, and vigor they emphasize a weak, passive, and disempowered approach to life, one where spirit fails to fully realize its potential through the physical instrument.

Acquiring fringe knowledge is like digging for diamonds in a mine field.

13 (edited by nexus 2007-10-08 05:35:18)

Re: My thought about music

I agree that much of the new agey music is pure fluff and not at all evocative of soul power.   It sounds kind of lost in wafty loops and i think it is.  I feel much of it is intellectual or originates in the soul's contact with the higher levels of the astral plane only .... not in spirit.   Spirit is all wise and knows how to appeal to us at all levels.  Spirit knows how to empower through music.  Some souls have attuned with inner spirit and have made themselves the instrument of it's power by creating sound and rhythms... music.   

But that power is not necessarily in yer face like the modern rock/pop.  It's powerful in a different way.  When one has a well developed appetite for modern rock/pop music it is not easy to listen to Beethoven [for example] with the soul faculties.   Although Beethoven gets very vigorous, and has the potential to ignite the soul in a deeply emotional way, it's not necessarilly going to happen to every listener.  Many people are too addicted to the energetic rush [in the wrong direction] that rock music produces.   Incapable of being moved by the spirit at a soul level they will prefer their favourite rocker.  Beethoven is just one example but i make the point that a person's life energies have to be literally redirected from the downward forces of modern rock/ pop and retrained in the natural flow and direction.   But to do this a person must literally confront the momentum of the lower- ego and it's appetites and addictions.   This is a very hard saying and most people will defend the object of their desire rather than confront it.


Like a piano there are 7 major and 5 minor chakras in the human system.  There are also numerous other light nodes in the body too but those 12 are the doors to divine consciousness.   I'm not saying that music shouldn't appeal to all the chakras.  Good music should and it does.  We are supposed to be integrated beings... spirit and matter [of various densities].   For various reasons that integration is now only relative and incomplete.  But that integration can be greatly enhanced by music that is created with the knowlege and intent to appeal to the natural tendencies of the flow of light in the chakras....ie... to rise gently, energise body and soul and be expressed as loving action in thought, feeling, word and deed. 

To the opposite end, most 'modern' music produces unnatural tendencies to the flow of energy in the chakra system [energies are forced down and are drenched in human desire] so it is a dis- integrating force.   It actually distorts the divine geometry of energy/matter.   It provokes ego- consciousness at both superficial and very deep subconscious levels.  It is tearing down the spiritual energies in the chakra system and causing the energy to be misqualified in all chakras [not just the lower chakras].  The only way to successfully balance and integrate our spiritual/ material nature is to reconnect with the inner spirit so that the light of spirit can flow into the cup of matter in geometric order.  That is integration and that is balance.  There is no integration and balance otherwise and if not there can be no spiritual potency in the individual.  The fallen beings know this.  The pied pipers of rock n roll are luring the masses on a merry dance although not many of them are likely to be consciously aware of the big picture.   They're just partyin'.  It is just another means for the ego- driven to revell in their lower natures.  Their discordant sounds and jagged rhythms are like a virus which has spread from the lab to the unwitting hosts of new generations.  But the ultimate goal of the inter- dimensional blackhats and [some of] their embodied tools is the dis-integration of body, soul and spirit in each individal. 

The ancient indian bhajan rhythms were devised by soulfull people who understood the divine science of rhythm and sound.  Some of it is meditative and some is very vigorous which includes dancing.   Another good example of balanced music is the old Celtic and european folk songs and those that made their way into the 'new world' and into americana, old time and some traditional bluegrass music.  [although some jazz/ blues influences appear in some.]  A lot of the older american folk music is a good example of 'physicality' and great for dancing so you're right about balance montalk.   These rhythms appeal to the 'real consciousness' within us and help to bring out soul consciousness.  That is where true power and creativity resides and is best expressed in the higher chakras... which just happens to be the direction in which energy naturally flows.  Rock music is a dumbing down of creativity and so it is ultimately dis- empowering.

In the higher music forms there is power and energy flowing as it should for the health of the whole system.  Soothing the mind, and envigorating the body and soul faculties, including in social dance gatherings,  it is not weak and passive.  It can help balance and integrate our whole spiritual/ material nature and empower us in ways the rockers cannot understand.   I am also not saying that every hillbilly is enlightened by his favourite folk music but at least he comes under a positive influence.

14 (edited by DarkStar 2007-10-06 00:29:31)

Re: My thought about music

joeman, I understand your reasons for wanting to give up on music altogether, but maybe you're being a little extreme here.  Please don't think I'm being judgemental or anything, but not ALL music is used as a means for mind control, although I'm sure the majority of it is.  (As in, the mainstream B.S. they try to shove down our throats, and maybe others, but I don't know.)

     Music captured my heart a long time ago, as far back as I can remember.  (And I remember things all the way back from when I was between 1 and 2 years old!  Music has always been very near and dear to me; I think it runs in my family, lol...that just made me think of my grandmother, my Nonny who would play all these records from the 20's, 30's, and 40's, and the way they made me feel...not just happy, but exctatic!  I used to love to dance around with her and hear her sing those songs, she had the most beautiful singing voice and those were some of the happiest times for me.  That's definitely a memory of her that I'm very grateful to have.  Sorry for sounding so corny there, I could go on and on about me, music and my family!) 

There are hundreds, maybe thousands of genres of music to choose from.  Please don't give up on it all just because of whatever music you have been exposed to has turned you off to it altogether.  You should at least explore everything (or as much as you can) music has to offer, and I'm almost positive you'll find something that you'll absolutely fall in love with.  Unless you're just not a music person, which I've never heard of, but I'm sure it's possible.

     As for me, I love all music, well almost all of it.  (As if you hadn't picked up on that already, lol...note to self:  try not to be so redundant! big_smile )  I can always find something I like about a certain genre that I previously would have never given a chance.   I won't go into all the genres I'm really into right now, but I will say that I have recently picked up quite an interest in traditional Greek music, as well as traditional and modern Gypsy music.  Something about that kind of music touches on something deep inside of me, and it's kind of hard to describe the feeling this music evokes in me.  Oh well, this topic is about you, not me, so I'll stop rambling now.  Sorry! smile

     Anyway, good luck with your decision!

"I (may) not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."
        -Voltaire

Re: My thought about music

joeman wrote: "you can tell me if I'm insane"

IMO, it is insane to eliminate all music. I would never consider such a move.

PhiConcept:

"I notice the urge to speed in my car while listening to top hits"

Me too.... right into an immovable object.
What kind of horrible crap are you listening to?

"Top hits"?
Gag me with a Casey Kasem.
It's simple guys, disregard the 'tuner' function. If temptation persists, snap the antenna off!

Good luck with all that.....           J

Happy to have been a part