• Registered: 2007-05-19

Re: Princess Diana Concert

Lono wrote:

Psychopractor, could you point me to some links/ books that describe this relationship?  My husband is putting together a presentation about the relationship between music and gang activity, and along the way he'll show how music has always played a part in movements.  I think adding the technical stuff about beats, etc., could really bring depth to it-- maybe open some eyes.

The art of MCing is to a large extent about creating a persona and being possessed by it. Watch MCs eyes when they ffreestyle, they are on another plane, another level; the eyes remind me of a Haitian ritual. Freestyling also reminds me of channeling methods like automatic writing etc.

The way MCs pick new names has some roots in the nation of islam and reminds me of secret/outer/inner names used in various orders and traditions. A good example would be the 'Eminem/Slim Shady/Marshall Mathers 'trinity.  Also the name being an authority (Lord Kitchener, Prince Buster, King Tubby, Duke Ellington, Count Basie etc) can be traced to calypso, reggae and jazz. Interesting to note that they also use superhero names (Tony Starks, Johnny Blaze etc).

Drumming patterns of reggae were partly based on Kumina drum rhythm. Kumina is the musical component of the Jamaican Pocomania religion - which is a bit like the Pentecostal church but with the congregation being possessed and taken up by the ancestors rather than the Holy Spirit. Religions like Pocomania are the direct Jamaican equivalent of religions such as Vodou in Haiti, Santeria in Cuba, Candomble in Brazil, etc.  But given the fact Jamaica was colonised by a Protestant country without the presence of the Catholic Saints, it's more difficult for the African Gods to find expression. However, Pocomania is still an aspect of the process of syncretism between African traditional religion and Christianity, like Voodou.

The rhythms of jazz begin in New Orleans after the US civil war. Marching band drums reutilized/detourned by the former slaves  and from there you get to rhythm and blues, swing, be-bop, rocknroll and funk. And of course hip hop. The slippery thing about hip hop regarding it's history and influences is that once the DJing (turntables) and MCing (rapping) techniques were developed they lend themselves to borrowing from any source really. DJ's grabbing vinyl from various musical and spoken word sources and MC's well...who knows? There might be an MC out there reading ee cummings, James Joyce and David Icke.

On a side note: On the track 'Ready to die' Biggie can be heard shouting out the number "93" as it fades out which may be a reference to Thelema.

Hopefully I have helped you and have not been too boring. Let me know if you need me to expand any ideas or want extra information.

This may be a useful book:

http://www.amazon.com/Shamanism-Racism- … amp;sr=8-1

and this is a book written by RZA, one of the Wu Tang Clan who definately has spiritual influences (for instance he is a 5 percenter, and seems like a pretty switched on guy)

http://www.amazon.com/Wu-Tang-Manual-En … amp;sr=1-1

and this in a thought provoking link:

http://coolmel.typepad.com/iblog/2003/1 … gatew.html

and an amusing clip from 'Coffee and Cigarettes' featuring RZA, GZA and Bill Murray:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6EZkIaJcCI

brain BAD! heart GOOD!

17 Reply by psychopractor (edited by psychopractor 2007-07-08 22:51:09)

  • Registered: 2007-05-19

Re: Princess Diana Concert

Oh and I just found out about this guy (source Wikipedia):

"Rammellzee's graffiti and his art work are based on his theory of Gothic Futurism, which describes the battle between letters and their symbolic warfare against any standardizations enforced by the rules of the alphabet; his treatise, "Iconic Panzerisms", details an anarchic plan by which to revise the role and deployment of language in society."

This echoes in my mind ancient ideas that language creates reality - whether it be logos of Judeo-Christanity, or the seed word (Aum) in Hinduism, etc.

"He was also instrumental as one of the original hip-hop artists from the New York area who introduced specific vocal styles which date back to the early 1980s. His influence can still be heard in contemporary artists such as The Beastie Boys and Cypress Hill."

"In a recent interview, he stated that his name is derived from "RAM" plus "'M' for 'Magnitude', 'Sigma' (?) the first summation operator, first 'L' - 'longitude', second 'L' - 'latitude', 'Z' - 'z-bar', ?, ? - 'summation'." He now performs in self-designed masks and costumes of different characters, which, as he states, represent the "mathematical equation" that is Rammellzee."

This reminds me of shamans and others using costumes and masks for ritual purposes.

edit: After a moment, though I haven't heard any of his output, Rammelzee strikes me as a hip hop equivelent of Sun Ra. Sun Ra in short was a mystical science fiction jazz composer...guy. More information for those interested at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun_Ra

brain BAD! heart GOOD!
  • Registered: 2007-01-04

Re: Princess Diana Concert

Critic Albert Goldman on Lenny Bruce's stand-up...its all about be-bop man wink


This was the moment that an obscure yet rapidly rising young comedian named Lenny Bruce chose to give one of the greatest performances of his career. ... The performance contained in this album is that of a child of the jazz age. Lenny worshipped the gods of Spontaneity, Candor and Free Association. He fancied himself an oral jazzman. His ideal was to walk out there like Charlie Parker, take that mike in his hand like a horn and blow, blow, blow everything that came into his head just as it came into his head with nothing censored, nothing translated, nothing mediated, until he was pure mind, pure head sending out brainwaves like radio waves into the heads of every man and woman seated in that vast hall. Sending, sending, sending, he would finally reach a point of clairvoyance where he was no longer a performer but rather a medium transmitting messages that just came to him from out there -- from recall, fantasy, prophecy. A point at which, like the practitioners of automatic writing, his tongue would outrun his mind and he would be saying things he didn't plan to say, things that surprised, delighted him, cracked him up -- as if he were a spectator at his own performance

My People Were Fair And Had Sky In Their Hair...But Now They're Content To Wear Stars On Their Brows

-Tyrannosaurus rex
  • lyra
  • lyra
  • Naked Emperor Pointer Outer
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  • Registered: 2004-03-25

Re: Princess Diana Concert

psychopractor wrote:

The way MCs pick new names has some roots in the nation of islam and reminds me of secret/outer/inner names used in various orders and traditions. A good example would be the 'Eminem/Slim Shady/Marshall Mathers 'trinity.

For me I always just saw the Eminem deal as being more along the lines of MPD/alter egos in the vain of mind control.  Only because he's a huge name music star and most modern music stars have their little "alter egos" going on nowadays.  It was talked about here:  http://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic. … 3&p=27  post 397 and beyond.  And this is the main "mind controlled celebrities" thread:  http://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?id=513   Mariah Carey = Mimi; Beyonce = Sasha; Britney Spears = Mona; Tori Amos and Janet Jackson = too many to name apparantly!  big_smile  Janet talked about all her alters in an interview and Tori has all of her alternate personas.  And Madonna is another major player with a lot of funny mind control/controlled puppet indicators surrounding her and whose whole career is based on her ever changing personas.  What's interesting to me is that it seems to mainly be major player music performers that have this openly going on.  Not actors and actresses, or other types of entertainers.  It's the singers who openly have alter-selves.   They're also not so coincidentally big time cash cows for their record labels, with the potential to sell millions of albums and do concerts around the world....which equates to them being puppets, pawns, tools.  Somebody has control over them and their alter ego names might be a reflection of that.   So I think Eminem may fall more into this category versus something akin to a tradition rooted in Islam and having to do with various orders and traditions, but that's just my opnion.  Could be off base, but I'm just looking at all the other singer/stage performers who have their alter egos and clearly have "funny stuff" surrounding them and thinking it might be related to that.

"Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "Holy shit ... what a ride!"  - Anonymous
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"I get by with a little help from my (higher density) friends."
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lyra's Website

20 Reply by psychopractor (edited by psychopractor 2007-07-09 20:25:18)

  • Registered: 2007-05-19

Re: Princess Diana Concert

Lyra: Although I hear what you are saying, and I agree with you to a certain extent about performers with MPD...it kind of goes with the territory of performing. I have been writing music and performing since I was thirteen and writing and performing stand up comedy for three years and I can say that the moment you stand up on stage you enter a different headspace. I definately noticed it more with the comedy, possibly because of the extra pressure involved. I am still me, but more me somehow, almost like a larger-than-life parody of myself. In fact some of my collegues and friends said I was more me on stage because for that brief time I was given permission by the public to shed my social conditioning and be 'myself' because anything I did or said would be written off as 'he's a wacky guy!'

Keep in mind that acting (which really all forms of performance falls under) was the product of shamanistic traditions with the witchdoctor imitating power animals, performing magical dances, and re-telling sacred stories (rather physically). The use of 'visual aids' almost goes without saying.

If you can drop those personas that we carry around for every situation and person we meet, it can be a rather liberating but also terrifying experience. I can see why it would be tempting for a performer to compartmentalise parts of themselves for performing, it's a real workout on the psyche, ego, etc - there's real potential for damage to the unwary. I found I preferred the energy of laughter to that of applause as a performer, the amount of energy that an audience can give to you which then you can then send back in this weird symbiosis is incredible. I even had a Carlos Castaneda-type experience on stage once where I had so much excess energy I saw (I can't recall the term he uses) these lines of consciousness that looked like fiber optic cables connecting us all together and I saw what the laughter was doing to us as a collective. It was this amazing purging process, like this huge collective spiritual orgasm cleansing all this dirty stuff out of our systems.

My point in all this is that sometimes when a person is given a mask or a role to play they can actually be more themselves then they are in their normal lives. I used to work with kids with mental disabilities and one of my co-workers created a set of  masks that the kids could wear to express themselves and almost universally they were a lot more effective at communicating their needs and themselves under the cover of a character.

“Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.” - Oscar Wilde

"Why are you wearing that stupid man suit?" - Frank from Donnie Darko

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  • Lono
  • Lono
  • Walker of worlds
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  • From: Oklahoma, USA
  • Registered: 2006-05-03

Re: Princess Diana Concert

Psychopractor, thank you for providing your insight and those links.  I'll take some time to peruse them and pass relevant info on to my hubby.  He can't get too "out there" with his presentation, but he'll be fascinated by the underpinnings of it all on a personal level.  Perhaps he'll be able to provide shades and hints to those with 'ears to hear' if he understands it more clearly.

I was also interested in your description of the larger-than-life persona you adopt while on stage, almost like a caricature  of yourself.  I think that's a really good way to put it, although I have no personal experience with performing in front of audiences.  I've often thought it would feel wonderful to be a stand-up comedian, getting paid to tell the truth in a way that would get you punched in the real world. big_smile

  • Registered: 2007-05-19

Re: Princess Diana Concert

Do it! Really. Put together 5 minutes of material and find an open mic night smile If you want some tips on structuring and editing let me know - there's a big difference between a joke and a funny idea. I had a myspace site but I deleted it because 1) Myspace is so vampiric 2) I have given performing a rest while I concentrate on writing for the moment. Stand up would be one of the most rewarding/soul destroying thing you could ever do - it's amazing. big_smile

brain BAD! heart GOOD!
  • From: Edmonton, Alberta
  • Registered: 2007-08-08

Re: Princess Diana Concert

Posted by Psyhopractor

"I even had a Carlos Castaneda-type experience on stage once where I had so much excess energy I saw (I can't recall the term he uses) these lines of consciousness that looked like fiber optic cables connecting us all together and I saw what the laughter was doing to us as a collective."

That's awesome, and cool because I'm reading "A seperate reality" by Carlos at the moment - tentacles is the word Don uses.

I'm a writer, but I've delved a little into performing as a rapper, and actor. I love the energy exchange on stage. My experience was with small crowds - I imagine a larger crowd would be even more thrilling. I love performing because it puts you in the now. And when you can access that infinite energy, you perform at a higher level than you would have ever thought possible. Or you fall out of the "now" and experience the worst night of your life.   

Stand-up comedy is something I've always wanted to try. I just never knew where to start. So, 5 minutes of material is what I should create? What's a good way to find an open mic? I live in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada.   

Thanks

aNDRE dILOn

  • Registered: 2007-01-09

Re: Princess Diana Concert

psychoraptor took the words out of my mouth, in response to lyra...

I am a musician, and I developed a stage name for myself. Then the stage name took over my ordinary name, and I became that person. So in the end I changed my name. Actually, it was only a first name. For the past few years I have had only a first name, and no last name. I've got a last name that I think I will adopt.

I have never been abducted, nor am I the subject of mind control. Finding a new name for myself has been a very interesting experiment in identity and ego. When I moved to a new city and introduced myself under my new name it was very strange, and I learned a lot. Now it's very strange when old friends and family call me by my old name.

If I were a popular musician I am sure I would have multiple titles, just for fun, and depending on the project.

One can have multiple personalities without being mind-controlled or crazy. For a performer it is necessary. One has to be able to seperate oneself from the projection of an audience.

  • From: Present Day Earth
  • Registered: 2006-01-13

Re: Princess Diana Concert

Interesting, I've entertained the idea of Stand Up Comedy as well. I think the energy of being on stage and in the moment is one part, another is the ability to spread awareness, new ideas and so on through your material, and then obviously having a "job" with no bosses!

About multiple 'persona's'; I agree with Mencius, they can be used to your benefit, adjusting your personality for the given situation.

  • Registered: 2007-06-27

Re: Princess Diana Concert

I wish people would let her go. Do we have 10 year concerts for your dead Mum? No, but it is obvious. She was so beautiful and charismatic, just perfect. And when the perfect angel passed away, maintaining those feelings of grief and anger can provide a fantastic source of loosh for many years to come.

But really, Diana is just human. Just like us, we really shouldn't be worshiping anyone. Certainly admire them and copy their behaviour if it benefits you, but to bow down to their image and defend their 'godliness' is just... ugh.