A bit heavy on the lightheartedness for me, but a sure remedy to the percieved weight of the subject and the confusion and mystification often wrought over it.

Another wonderful treatment of the subject was Israel Regardie's "A Garden of Pomegranates"

In the end it is a system of symbolic attribution of concepts to a pythagorean decad supplemented by a 22-fold alphabet (with concepts tied to the letters as they are to the numbers) arranged in a glyph known as the "tree of life" or the "32 paths of wisdom".

The numbers of the decad form stations a scheme that descends from the monad to manifestation, stations that are interconnected by paths formed by the letters. Thus the letters also have the attribution of balancing the natures of the two stations they connect, along with zodiac, planetary or elemental attributions.

Meditations are done on the concepts, divine names attributed to them are invoked or visited in visions and the qabalist attempts reintegration of their spiritual self via ascention of the tree from manifestation (10) back to unity (1) partaking of the gnosis of these "portions of creation", and learning what part of themselves and their world they are.

The tree is so considered a map of creation and a map of humanity, macrocosm and microcosm, as above so below etc. etc... it's actually quite simple and once one aquires the symbolic alphabet no "trusting other's interpretations" is necessary. You tweak the machine on the fly until it becomes yours. It is a tool for interpreting reality and conciousness.

The mole and nature of the foundational hebrew texts keeps many fom learning about qabalah, as does it's association with a single religion and of course all the new age channeled stuff about evil aliens giving us the trojan horse of monotheism, etc etc. Either of the two books I suggested can disabuse one of all the idle speculation and show what the system is, as a living system today.

stephen m wrote:

I'd love to talk to a Mystic Jewish   Rabbi about it, but as far as I know, they're not talking.

Stephen,
Aaronfirebrand mentioned mystic Judaism (perhaps not those exact words) awhile back in a post.  I asked him if he was referring to Kaballah but (sigh) he never answered.

My understanding is that kaballah is the mystical aspect of Judaism.  Therefore a "mystic Jewish Rabbi" would be a Kaballist and a Rabbi.

Is this incorrect?  Could you tell me what you are referring to when you say Mystic Jewish Rabbi?

Thanks very much.

Christine B.

Hi Christine, I think I just pulled that term out of the air.

I have held in my mind the impression that in order to learn Qabalah through the Jewish tradition you had had to be a member of the faith and put in years of study before you were granted access to the knowledge. This goes back to the whole 'word of mouth' thing as there is no official 'Book of the Qabalah' and was kept that way purposefully to protect the knowledge. I've even heard the story that the original Ten Commandments (the ones that got smashed to pieces) were the Qabalah. There are two books or texts that go deep into the philosophy of the Qabalah, the Zohar and the Sepher Yetzirah. This is where the knowledge of the Hebrew language comes into play, either that or rely on the translations of the Golden Dawn guys. Certainly, the language barrier itself acts as a bit of a firewall of protection.

This impression was given to me from what I read, all of it from the western tradition which may have enhanced this idea to add to it's mystique, I don't know. Currently, there may be a lot more information available from the Jewish tradition, I haven't really looked to be honest, but perhaps will, Lamed Vavniks sounds interesting.

In a way it is a dichotomy of sorts. The beauty of it is that it is a system of knowledge that you learn by interacting with it and meditating on the concepts of it and only through that will it come alive and have meaning to you. Unfortunately, to obtain the concepts to meditate on, you will either have to trust somebody elses interpratation or be prepared to study your ass off for years. I guess I must have given up and took the hamburger.

Or then again, maybe you could just go ride a bike and it will all come to you, ha.

Stephen

Thank you for the essay on Lamed Vavniks and Jewish mysticism.  You're right, Tom's search engine works great.

I certainly don't think of you as a fool to enter into the various discussion ... but I empathize with the feeling.  I often feel that way as well.

Christine B.

My asylum comment was regarding the last week or so...

Well okay, but I'm remined of a quote I read that said "Earth is the insane asylum of the Universe".  I don't know who said it, but I sure was yanking my head up and down for reading it.

Cool beans Brother/Man!

I believe I'm a fool half the time for even getting involved in some of the "discussions".

While I can readily identify with your sentiment about feeling like a "fool half the time" for getting involved (how I push past it sometimes, I'll never know... I suppose I don't mind making a fool of myself)... well, I just want you to know I've gotten a good deal of education, and even some growth mr. 'fire, from reading your thoughts, as well as fellowship and support.  Also, what comes off the page at me when reading your words looks a lot like wisdom, EXPERIENTIAL wisdom... even if I'm not agreeing with you, or don't yet know how to agree or disagree with you (and I'm not just blowing sunshine up your energy field here either "old man" ).

I, as only one NR member (not speaking for any other), don't have to agree with you or any other just to recognize how I can grow from your/their ideas... even if my growth comes from my own sense of disdain or disbelief.  This I'm called forth to do, by virtue of being in the body and being a "seeker", the conflict of ideas serves me to "grow out of" personal complacency.

You HAVE awakened into an "asylum", duality can be real putrid and it blows chunks sometimes... because of the dualistic nature of our "reality" for every piece of in-formation there's likely to be an equal and reactive piece of dis-in-formation. Like I said--it blows chunks.

And if you think your just on "Automatic" drive, as you say, then I  would really, really like to see you put it into gear.  But then again, Snicker! Snort!... maybe that's one of those "be careful what you ask for little girl, you just might get it" things. I've always been a "spiritual" fast track kind of woman though, I'd probably be able to handle it <she writes sensing a big Nor'westerly wind about to blow her so'easterly way>.

Christine, it appears that you are saying there is no such thing as absolute truth when you state that "any path which says it is the only way to freedom is a trap". By that, do you mean that there is no "true path", which would represent an absolute truth?

I don't understand you, why the fact that there is more than one path would mean there is no absolute truth? Or did I get something wrong? As I see it, we are all going to the same destination, the One or whatever you want to call it, but there are vastly different ways to reach this goal. And we would not have an entire picture of the Truth if there was not all these different paths. What do you think?

Excuse the brusque nature of this post. I feel as though I've awakened in an asylum. And I'm on Automatic for the duration.

I wasn't even slightly upset -- I guess I should have put a smiley face along with the sigh --
I'll have to go back into the various threads to see what you posted.  I guess I must have missed your answer, it was awhile ago and could have been sent when I was out of town due to the hurricane scare here in Tampa Bay a couple of weeks ago.  In any case, thanks for answering and I'll go look to see what you had to say.  (I don't even remember which "Topic" it was in ... and I find it rather hard at times to find topics which become buried in time)

IF I made it sound as if I don't believe there is absolute truth, I should have emphasized that I don't like it when various systems/religions/paths claim to be "THE ONLY ONE"

It's the organization/system/path that I object to ... not the TRUTH within a path.

I can't really see how you feel I was saying that while most teaching is faulty there is no reason to assume all teaching is.  I try to assume nothing.  (not that I succeed all the time mind you). 

In fact, because I don't assume I was willing and continue to be willing to check out Kabbalah -- (and other teachings) which if I took things at face value here on NR, I would not have had the inclination to check it out -- for myself. 

But, are we actually saying the same thing about truth, absolute truth and paths?  I think we agree and there seems to be some miscommunication entering into the post.

In any case, thanks for the answer to jewish mysticism.  I'll check it what you had to say.  Sorry I jumped the gun...errr, assumed you had not answered.:)

Christine B.

Thanks very much for the clarification.  I agree completely - any path which says it is the "only" way to freedom is a trap.

But, rather than throw out the baby with the bath water, I prefer to learn as much as I can about various paths which I resonant with ... and take from each of them what works for me, throwing out the rest.

Which according to an (ex)Toltec friend of mine, makes me a worthless self-help junkie ... ahh, the compassion and empathy of the fully enlightened <said with a smidge of irony>

Never ceases to amaze me how the "enlightened" can be so incredibly judgemental.

I'm going to have to find that book you referenced "Handbook from the New Paradigm"

Thanks, again.
Christine B

ermolai wrote:

At any case, you don't need it for spiritual progress anymore than you need other tools.

Ermolai,

Could you clarify this statement, please?  Are you saying that the tools of Kaballah are no more important than other tools?  Or are you saying that spiritual tools are not important for spiritual growth?  Or are you saying something completely different.  I'm sorry but it's not clear to me.

This is as a caution against those who would make you believe that knowledge of the Kaballah is absolutely crucial to reach "enlightenment" or whatever, or that if you don't know it then you're just a "novice", IE the idea that there is One True Path.

I believe that these esoteric traditions had values in the past in the sense that they were like paths already walked by others through the veils of illusions, so by keeping to it, it was easier (somewhat) for people to free themselves (whenever someone cross a veil, it's easier for those behind him/her). However what is going now (and until 2012) is totally different since there are millions of seekers/diggers and the aim, as I see it, is to dig the entire Matrix until we can all be free. On the other hand, since at the same time the Matrix is "closing down", I have the feeling that many of these ancient traditions are riddled with traps and there is not one I would trust entirely. This goes with this quote from the Handbook from the New Paradigm (on the other thread) according to which we need creativity, that is, our own creative path.

At any case, you don't need it for spiritual progress anymore than you need other tools.

Ermolai,

Could you clarify this statement, please?  Are you saying that the tools of Kaballah are no more important than other tools?  Or are you saying that spiritual tools are not important for spiritual growth?  Or are you saying something completely different.  I'm sorry but it's not clear to me.

Stephen,
Aaronfirebrand mentioned mystic Judaism (perhaps not those exact words) awhile back in a post.  I asked him if he was referring to Kaballah but (sigh) he never answered.

My understanding is that kaballah is the mystical aspect of Judaism.  Therefore a "mystic Jewish Rabbi" would be a Kaballist and a Rabbi.

Is this incorrect?  Could you tell me what you are referring to when you say Mystic Jewish Rabbi?

Thanks very much.

Christine B.