Predictable/ routine is also a character of the reptilian. I must admit I don't know if reptilians can have souls or not, but breaking out of routines and predictability is certainly beneficial for us it helps us be more conscious of the now.

These types will always take the same route, even if multiple alternative routes are available, they might somehow think these as 'forbidden'.

"It's not the most direct path- so I must never consider it" they must think.

Also, they are very much monkey-see-monkey-do relating to things like simplifying tasks. They are shown one way of doing things, and have no concept of the word *innovation*. 

There does seem to be a fine distinction between practical effciency, and being in a rut. There is just no desire to see or do things in a different manner.

Same radio station every day, they don't even notice that the playlist never changes. Little things like that have annoyed me to no end for eons.

Predictable is how they like everything.
Seldom do they realize that the same course through the maze will always net the same results.

Routine=rut=insanity

              J

LightEye wrote:

I have emboldened Nexus's quote within. You have all most likely heard variations on the last bit about serving two masters. In the context of the parable, I'm having trouble applying the idea of OPs to this verse. What does everyone think?

Although I cannot find it at the moment, Mouravieff in his Gnosis books elaborated on just this point. To paraphrase, the so-called "pre-adamic" beings (aka organic portals, or people without the higher chakras) are native to this world, while those who fell or descended here from higher realms are like fish out of water. If you think about it, the faculties of empathy and conscience are an obstacle to getting ahead in this world, because the world is built and dominated by those who lack those. Getting ahead in real estate, the corporate ladder, and the entertainment industry requires more often than not a sense of ruthlessness and sacrifice of one's own higher spiritual aspirations. So the rules in this world are quite simply stacked against those who are in this world, but not of this world.

We Noble Realmers know all about this actually, how we see others who are very well plugged into the Matrix and feel at home within the system prospering quite nicely, but how we have difficulty living that life because it simply doesn't fit with who we are.

There was a time, many years ago, when I tried desperately to "fit in" among the others, those who really "got ahead". I failed miserably. Which was a good thing, as in the end, I had no choice but to accepts that I was different.

Furthermore, it is often a paradox, that when you stop trying, and as it was eloquently put earlier in this thread "accept who and where you are", things will flow your way. Even material things, althought you won't be needing them as you once used to.

My one only 'real-life' friend is one who is also like me. We feel alot alike sometimes. She's told me about how there are times--usually when sleeping--that she feels like she's downloading or whatever. I've also had that before. Also, I don't remember my dreams very often. I don't know if that's connected or not. Maybe I'm just not dreaming very much because of the nightly download.  Or maybe I'm just totally frickin off my rocker and imagining all of this....

Hi Seeking the Truth, I seem to have passed over this post when I first read the thread. You described something I've been feeling a lot lately actually for some years now. The inability to remember dreams and the feeling that I'm "downloading" while I sleep. In fact, just the other night I woke up for no particular reason and realized I had been having an in depth conversation with someone who was sitting in front of me with their legs crossed. The person was telling me something and I remember feeling vaguely annoyed, like I didn't want to be there, but I had to listen.

These were all gossamer realizations that flashed through my head upon awakening. As usual, they dissipated rather quickly once I fully woke up. Sometimes I can catch just the tail end of these elaborate conversations but never the whole picture!! Something is definately blocking me from remembering it consciously.

I also have dreams about going on "missions" or tests. Once I had to sneak around a large building and find the headquarters for this group. Another time, and this had no relation to my waking life mind you, I came into my apartment to find two Russian men standing by my window. They said: "No one will hear you so don't bother screaming" I did anyway [mentally, as loudly as I could] and my cat jumped on top of me waking me up, I love her

I later found out there was a Russian embassy building not far from where I live The strange thing about the dream was it took place early in the morning and wasn't triggered by anything I could remember in real life.

"Thus preached Hermes: "O people of the earth, men born and made of the elements, but with the spirit of the Divine Man within you, rise from your sleep of ignorance! Be sober and thoughtful. Realize that your home is not in the earth but in the Light. Why have you delivered yourselves over unto death, having power to partake of immortality? Repent, and change your minds. Depart from the dark light and forsake corruption forever. Prepare yourselves to climb through the Seven Rings and to blend your souls with the eternal Light."
Some who heard mocked and scoffed and went their way, delivering themselves to the Second Death from which there is no salvation. But others, casting themselves before the feet of Hermes, besought him to teach them the Way of Life"

montalk already cited the C's mentioning the "second death" in relation to the "organic portals" question.  When I read the above sentence (in bold) about the mocking scoffers I immediately thought of the typical reactions that the type of people fitting under the OP model would take after hearing such things relating to the spiritual wakening that Hermes was prescribing...

Just wanted to share that obscure yet intriguing reference to the "second death".  I'm wondering if LKJ read the STOAA before or after that session.  I'm pretty sure it was before...

Either way,  if the "children of this world" simply SEE themselves as wiser "in their own generation" than the "children of light" it is perfectly understandable that they do.   Because they have not SEEN the full potential of the "children of light".  If we rightly understand Jesus' message we can become Christ ourselves because it is our own inner identity.   Then we really will be "wise as a serpent and gentle as a dove".    The "children of this world" will then no longer SEE themselves as "wiser in their own generation" because the "children of the light" will SEE straight through them.   This will be true whether or not they are soulless or, are souls asleep.

Bob Marley - 'Wisdom'

The lips of the righteous teach many,
But fools die for want of wisdom.
The rich man wealth is in his city;
Do you hear, do you hear, can you understa-and?!

Destruction of the poor, is poverty;
Destruction of the soul, is vanity.
The righteous' wealth is in his Holy Pla-ace.
do you hear?

Those who have eyes, to see will see!

The rich man wealth is in his city;
do you hear, do you believe, do you understand?!

Destruction of the poor is poverty.
Destruction of the soul is vanity,
well hear me children!
The righteous' wealth is in his Holy Pla-ace!

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Peace, PhiConcept.

Either way,  if the "children of this world" simply SEE themselves as wiser "in their own generation" than the "children of light" it is perfectly understandable that they do.   Because they have not SEEN the full potential of the "children of light".  If we rightly understand Jesus' message we can become Christ ourselves because it is our own inner identity.   Then we really will be "wise as a serpent and gentle as a dove".    The "children of this world" will then no longer SEE themselves as "wiser in their own generation" because the "children of the light" will SEE straight through them.   This will be true whether or not they are soulless or, are souls asleep.

,
"The children of this world are, in their generation, wiser than the children of light."

The children of the world see themselves wiser than they see the children of light.

Selfish nature of souls asleep.

Peace, PhiConcept.

"The children of this world are, in their generation, wiser than the children of light."   

Although my original quote differed slightly, that is the exact quote from the 'King James Version' [KJV] of the bible.   I prefer this version to the modern translations.   Somethings always get lost or changed when translating from one language to another.   And 'modernising' the scriptures adds another degree of separation to the original meaning... although some versions are better than others. 

There are many ways to interpret spiritual teachings and scriptural quotes.  They are layered and multi- dimentional so they can be interpreted on various levels.  This doesn't mean that only one is right and all others have to be wrong.

People who are of the earth, "earthy" [ OPs? ] know well the shrewd ways of the world and the motivations of men.   They are more shrewd in their worldly knowledge than the children of the light are in their spiritual knowledge.   The 'children of this world' are more self aware in their 'generation' of worldly, lower psychic forces than the "children of the light" are aware of their spiritual identity and their generation of spiritual forces.   Could one interpretation of this passage include Jesus' making an oblique reference to people who have not originated in spirit?  I think it could.  The whole passage is shrouded in an allegory after all.   Just because the whole parable deals with the goods of this world and debts etc,  doesn't mean it doesn't have deeper meanings.  Everything is about consciousness and different states of consciousness.  As different people embody different states of consciousness one meaning could refer to people of different evolutions. ie. ensouled people spiritually evolving and soulless people not spiritually evolving.

Montalk answered Dreamosis with a quote from Matthew to illustrate the presence of OPs and again the 'Matthew' quote could also refer to states of consciousness within ourselves.  [both interpretations are not mutually exclusive]

The inner fire of the holy spirit separates and consumes the "chaff" of the ego- self from the "wheat" of soul consciousness during a time of harvest [now].  It is a cyclical time of "judgement" [now] when the opportunity to surrender the lower- self into the flame of the inner Christ is given to the people of earth.  We just have to be willing to go through the process of seeing through the animal of the 'not- self' and sacrificing it on the altar of the christ flame within.  It may also be a time when for some people [eg. the OPs?] time is up.  Montalk alluded to that difference between people by quoting Revelation 20:14- 15.   And,  by quoting Mouravieff, he explained that it could just as easily refer to the different elements of consciousness within ourselves as well as the dissolution of OPs.   I don't think we must wait for physical death to experience some of these separations of consciousness within ourselves.  The fire [written about in Matthew and Revelation] can do it's work [if we will do our work] while we are embodied too.  The 'refiners fire' can refine the 'wheat' of soul- consciousness as it separates and dissolves the 'chaff' of ego- consciousness now.

Incidentally, in the KJV of the bible Luke writes " You cannot serve both God and mammon."  Although the scripture goes on to say that the Pharisees were lovers of money, the preceeding passage at Luke 16:14 does not say "money".... it says "mammon."  ie... the things of this world.   Or... materialism and the materialistic consciousness.  So, "mammon" refers to the worldly consciousness as a "thing" of this world.    Some people prefer the "things of this world" [the ego- consciousness] over a real honest relationship with God and other people.   

If we seek to serve both the worldly ego- consciousness in self and the world, and we also seek to serve the inner christ consciousness then we will not succeed.  The tension must be resolved by becoming who we really are.  No man can serve two masters and find spiritual identity and peace. 

I also quoted Jesus earlier saying  "No man ascends to the father except he who has descended from the father"
I wasn't referring to John 14:6 as PhiConcept thought.   I was referring to John 3:13.   The exact quote is : "No-one has ascended into heaven but he who has descended from heaven.... even the son of man which is in heaven."   In this case i don't think my paraphrase mangled the quote too badly but it was incomplete.  There are several ways to interpret this passage and the "OP" idea is just one.

We Noble Realmers know all about this actually, how we see others who are very well plugged into the Matrix and feel at home within the system prospering quite nicely, but how we have difficulty living that life because it simply doesn't fit with who we are.

Wow, Montalk. Thank you for articulating something I could not. That explains why I am so wary to "go along" the same way everyone else does.

Love what Falvion said:

This ties in to acceptance. Only after we accept our own identity can we begin to understand it. Once we understand it, we begin to discover our purpose if we go after it. Fish out of water, indeed.

I love this analogy. So poetic, yet so true.

That sounds about right. Although I always imagined them being thrown into a black hole. It's the dramatist in me.

I've often wondered if Jesus' saying that "the chaff" will be thrown into the fire is a reference to OPs also.

Yes, here are the pieces to put together:

The "fire" is what burns up transient dross and leaves only the permanent and divine. The second death is dissolution of the etheric and astral shells along with the lower self after physical death. For those familiar with Steiner's work, it encompasses the process by which departed individuals go through a period of having their earthly attachments burned off before they become free enough to pass on fully, this process being not without torment. The movie Jacob's Ladder kind of depicted this.

With organic portals having no permanent core of individualized consciousness, nothing survives this dissolution and so their energy of awareness disintegrates and probably merges back formlessly into the soul pool they came from. The fire could also relate to the idea that higher density STS meet their eventual fate by imploding and being reformulated and regenerated as 1D primal matter. Fire takes something with form and reduces it to formless ashes. Baptism by fire means purification for those with individualized consciousness and obliteration for those without.

...Anyway, I know the thread is about OPs...

I've often wondered if Jesus' saying that "the chaff" will be thrown into the fire is a reference to OPs also.

I made little healthy progress to returning to this state until I began to look at the world more positively.  I think Ekart Tolle says something to the fact that you can't truly be happy until you can learn to accept where you are.  Perhaps I am not perceiving the point you are trying to make, but I could not see any direction to move in my life when I was unhappy and looking for all of the faults of reality and the nature of this illusion.

If I may be so bold--and not to put words in your mouth, Montalk--but I don't necessarily think Montalk was talking about being unhappy with your state. What this says to me is that, if you have a compassionate and spiritual nature, it's hard to act with the ruthlessness and cold selfishness it seems to require to "do well" in the world--i.e.; financial success, fame, power, and all the other trappings of this 3D existence. This is so because, if you're spiritual, you don't want to "move up" at the expense of others; instead, you'd rather cooperate to build something that could benefit everyone.

If you choose a more spiritual path, you won't have all the trappings of a "successful" life as we've been brought up (indoctrinated) to expect or want because you won't pursue them, but that shouldn't make us unhappy. I thoroughly agree with you, Capitan, when you say true happiness begins with accepting where you are. When you can do that, then all the "stuff" becomes immaterial, and you can focus on the loving, spiritual path that Montalk speaks about.

Just my two cents.

Excellent thread, by the way.

Cheers

We Noble Realmers know all about this actually, how we see others who are very well plugged into the Matrix and feel at home within the system prospering quite nicely, but how we have difficulty living that life because it simply doesn't fit with who we are.

I too have felt like a fish out of water my entire life, but what are we supposed to do?  She would we be just be unhappy until we get our way.  I feel personally that I have not been able to make any real progress in my life until I began to try and learn the predicament then I am in rather then change the world around me to what I feel it should be.  That however has not kept me from striving for the unnameable state of being that is on the tip of my mind just beyond the grasp of conscious remembrance but close enough that I can taste it.  I made little healthy progress to returning to this state until I began to look at the world more positively.  I think Ekart Tolle says something to the fact that you can't truly be happy until you can learn to accept where you are.  Perhaps I am not perceiving the point you are trying to make, but I could not see any direction to move in my life when I was unhappy and looking for all of the faults of reality and the nature of this illusion.

I have emboldened Nexus's quote within. You have all most likely heard variations on the last bit about serving two masters. In the context of the parable, I'm having trouble applying the idea of OPs to this verse. What does everyone think?

Although I cannot find it at the moment, Mouravieff in his Gnosis books elaborated on just this point. To paraphrase, the so-called "pre-adamic" beings (aka organic portals, or people without the higher chakras) are native to this world, while those who fell or descended here from higher realms are like fish out of water. If you think about it, the faculties of empathy and conscience are an obstacle to getting ahead in this world, because the world is built and dominated by those who lack those. Getting ahead in real estate, the corporate ladder, and the entertainment industry requires more often than not a sense of ruthlessness and sacrifice of one's own higher spiritual aspirations. So the rules in this world are quite simply stacked against those who are in this world, but not of this world.

We Noble Realmers know all about this actually, how we see others who are very well plugged into the Matrix and feel at home within the system prospering quite nicely, but how we have difficulty living that life because it simply doesn't fit with who we are.