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	<title type="html"><![CDATA[Noble Realms — Near Death Experiences: What About War In Heaven?]]></title>
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	<updated>2007-01-05T08:42:16Z</updated>
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			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Near Death Experiences: What About War In Heaven?]]></title>
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			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>As Noted Elsewhere/s:</p><p><strong>the virusites are all but totally extinguished</strong> </p><p>The only thing currently taking ‘time’ is the Absolute and Total Removal (In ALL Dimensions And Densities) from, ‘The Host/s’.</p><br /><p>[Re-Member when YOU Removed that computer virus / distortion.......?]</p><br /><br /><p>As Noted Here:</p><p><a href="http://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?id=3966">http://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?id=3966</a>&nbsp; &nbsp;#8</p><br /><p>This is a Representation of YOU and YOUR Friends From The Deep </p><p>Dealing With the zone of lies and distortion:</p><br /><br /><p><span class="postimg"><img src="http://www.durham.gov.uk/recordoffice/usp.nsf/lookup/d~dli0007~0404~0042_l/$file/d~dli0007~0404~0042_l.jpg" alt="http://www.durham.gov.uk/recordoffice/usp.nsf/lookup/d~dli0007~0404~0042_l/$file/d~dli0007~0404~0042_l.jpg" /></span> </p><br /><br /><p><strong>This Represents The Recapitulation:</strong> </p><br /><br /><p><span class="postimg"><img src="http://www.almissa.com/vijesti/Buchenwald_2005_files/image003.jpg" alt="http://www.almissa.com/vijesti/Buchenwald_2005_files/image003.jpg" /></span> </p><br /><br /><p><strong>And As YOU Walk Out</strong></p><p><strong>This Time:</strong></p><p><strong>No lies</strong></p><p><strong>No deceivers</strong></p><br /><p><strong>Only The Truth Of Who WE Really Are</strong> </p><br /><br /><p><span class="postimg"><img src="http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b321/siriarc/20070106-1.jpg" alt="http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b321/siriarc/20070106-1.jpg" /></span></p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[SiriArc]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=555</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2007-01-05T08:42:16Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=50129#p50129</id>
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		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Near Death Experiences: What About War In Heaven?]]></title>
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			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>You&#039;ve raised some very interesting and important questions.&nbsp; I like the fact that you went to both sides (maybe the Theocrats are trying to get us away from the warm, loving light).&nbsp; What you&#039;ve identified is the issue with every new idea, every channeling.&nbsp; To me, the most important point that&#039;s made in the WiH material is the need for us to develop psychic discernment.&nbsp; The more information we have, the better a position we&#039;re in, and that includes subtle information we get on the Astral planes.&nbsp; </p><p>As for me, I think this stuff is important to entertain, but I won&#039;t know for sure until I get there.&nbsp; At that point, I&#039;ll use my discernment to make a decision.&nbsp; Even if I&#039;m wrong, they can&#039;t keep me there forever.&nbsp; I&#039;m way too stiff-necked for that. <img src="https://forum.noblerealms.org/img/smilies/smile.png" width="15" height="15" alt="smile" /></p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[Lono]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=988</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2007-01-04T16:16:25Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=50100#p50100</id>
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		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Near Death Experiences: What About War In Heaven?]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=50093#p50093" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>This is suprising. When I look at some traditional sources I usually use for work, I see NDE articles! Here&#039;s an abstract from a Japanese scientific journal. This is from Pubmed, a good summary on NDEs: </p><br /><br /><br /><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>Implication of near-death experience for the elderly in terminal care [Article in Japanese]</p><p>Yamamura H.</p><p>Department of Medicine and Gerontology, Kyorin University School of Medicine.</p><p>Near-death experience (NDE) was studied in a series of 48 consecutive patients who were admitted to hospital in a deep coma (level III on the III-3 coma scale) due to cardiac arrest, pulmonary failure, cerebrovascular accident, and/or other life-threatening disease. When the patients recovered from coma without complications such as aphasia, dementia or mental disturbance, they were interviewed by the same physician following the same protocol consisting of 25 questions about their experience during the period of deep coma. Of 48 patients interviewed, 14 (37%) had a vivid and undeniably personal experience during their unconscious state. Factors attributable to the NDE were assessed by the following three methods. First, the frequency and odds ratio were examined in terms of gender, age, underlying disease, occupation, religion, education, site of accident, duration of comatose state, drugs and treatment for resuscitation, and drugs being taken at the time of interview. There were no specific factors significantly related to the NDE. Next, background factors were compared between the NDE positive and negative groups to detect a particular factor related to the NDE. However, there were no factors that showed significant frequency in the NDE-positive group. Finally, discriminatory analysis was performed to detect discriminatory factors in the occurrence of NDE by selecting NDE as an objective variable and background factors as explanatory variables. However, the discriminatory equation gained was not significant. Thus, there were no background factors that could explain the occurrence of NDE. Among the NDE reported, there were such elements as flying in a dark void space with dim light ahead, encountering dead relatives or friends, standing at the boundary of brook, river or pond, and returning to the world in response to a voice calling from behind. These elements are common to those reported by investigators abroad, except for the lack of a tunnel experience. As for the influence of the NDE on life subsequent to the experience, the majority of patients who had had a NDE stated that they became more sincere to towards every aspect of life and held spiritual values in high esteem than before. This was quite a contrast to the attitudes in the non-NDE patients who looked upon the comatose episode as arising from an underlying disease and considered it a health problem only. Most of the NDE patients considered that death was neither fearful nor difficult, but calm and peaceful if it occurs in a manner similar to that in their NDE. From this study, a picture can be down of the dying process, based on empirical information, it can also be seen that a NDE causes the individual to develop a sincere introspective depth. It is possible that these findings may be applicable to elderly patients in terminal care.</p></blockquote></div><p>I can&#039;t help remembering new TV series 4400. Some abducted people (4400 people exactly) suddenly appears near a lakeshore and they all have various powers. NDE&#039;ers maybe 4400&#039;ers it seems!</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[feritciva]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=128</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2007-01-04T12:42:00Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=50093#p50093</id>
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		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Near Death Experiences: What About War In Heaven?]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=50085#p50085" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>Very good logical stuff Feritciva!</p><p>I always read that the astral stuff is very like Earth, so if Earth is that<br />shit astral should be too, so knowledge/awareness is the way to raise<br />“the head&quot; above the &quot;misty&quot; to see, have a better view and not be fooled.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[Pictus]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=878</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2007-01-04T10:00:43Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=50085#p50085</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Near Death Experiences: What About War In Heaven?]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=50082#p50082" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>Another thing: I suggest everybody who’s interested in this subject to watch Chronicles of Riddick closely. This film is mentioned before on NR and Montalk wrote a great summary of the film somewhere in movies thread I suppose. The Necromangers in the film are the converters; they come as a comet – in fact lots of ships CONNECTED together as a pile – to a planet, then the ships SEPERATES from the pile and gets to the planet. They give two choices to the local species; convert to their religion and total control of course, or die. There is also an Elemental played by Judi Dench. She is chained and held captive by Necromangers. Of course you have to ignore Vin Diesel factor in the film, but it seems most of the movie script comes directly from IC.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[feritciva]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=128</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2007-01-04T09:24:15Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=50082#p50082</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Near Death Experiences: What About War In Heaven?]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=50080#p50080" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>(Sorry, this will be long) <br />I’m reading Dr. Melvin Morse’s studies on NDE with WiH on my mind, especially this part: </p><br /><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>We also have another word of caution for people who have accepted the information<br />in War in Heaven as true, but are not serious occultists with highly developed psychic<br />powers. They should read accounts of point-of-death experiences and learn to<br />recognize the common tricks that the Theocrats use to enslave the unwary after death.<br />Q. Yes. I’ve read all those stories about the dying person being met by spirits who<br />claim to be deceased relatives or friends, deities or messengers of deities, there to<br />welcome him or her to the afterlife. I suspect that many people who believe the<br />breakthrough information while living may suddenly forget it when confronted after<br />death with the “shade of their beloved mother, come to welcome them to heaven.”&nbsp; In<br />other words, “Seeing is believing&quot;. A direct emotional confrontation of this type<br />might have more weight than any rational, intellectual knowledge received during life,<br />especially to a soul who has just undergone the trauma of dying.<br />A. That is an accurate and vivid description. We still lose people that way every day,<br />in spite of our best efforts.<br />Q. What can people do to avoid such deceptions?<br />A. The only sure defense is to achieve a certain degree of psychic development. The<br />Theocrats are able to practice such tricks only if the psychic senses of the deceased<br />person are being activated from outside by the Theocrats’ telepathic transmissions. If<br />the person’s soul is actively perceiving the astral environment with its own telepathic<br />and clairvoyant powers, it can usually perceive the true nature of the spirits forming<br />the “greeting party&quot;. This is difficult to put into English, so let’s just say they “look<br />phony”&nbsp; or “have bad vibes&quot;. The closest we can come to an actual description is that<br />some of the psychic control mechanisms that the Theocrats use to enslave other spirits<br />on the astral plane become perceptible to anyone who psychically “reads&quot; them<br />actively, instead of being communicated with while remaining passive.<br />Q. This is one of the elements of the breakthrough information that will frighten<br />certain readers, especially when they realize that many of their deceased relatives and<br />friends may be slaves in Theocratic bands right now. Suppose such a person does<br />meet his or her dead mother or some other loved-one on the astral plane?<br />A. The important rule is. KEEP YOUR DISTANCE. DON’T LET ANY OTHER<br />SPIRIT “TOUCH YOU AS LONG AS YOU REMAIN ON THE ASTRAL PLANE.<br />Free Spirits merely communicate telepathically. They don’t approach other spirits<br />closely, even when they assist them in reincarnating, but instead “talk them through<br />the process. Remember: “TALK, BUT DON’T TOUCH&quot;.</p></blockquote></div><p>Dr. Morse is a well known doctor with his work on NDE. His great advantage for me is scientific view instead of religious or new-age believer attitude. He takes all his patients’ accounts in a balanced and objective manner and reports as a scientific article. Here are some examples in his book Transformed By Light (I’m reading this book in Turkish, so I have to summarize with my own words)</p><br /><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>Patient 1 “dies&quot; because of extreme high fever. He’s in a hospital but doctors cannot help him. He’s 9 yrs old and suddenly sees himself in the tunnel. He looks back to see hospital room and the doctors near his body. When he walks through the tunnel he’s in a garden full of beautiful flowers and horses. He wants to go to the horses when he feels a presence beside him. The being asks “where are you going&quot; and he says to the horses. The being says “great! let’s go together&quot;. He goes with the being, he cannot see the being’s face clearly as this is a very bright light. But he’s not afraid anyway. When they come near the horses he hears another voice. “what’s he doing here?&quot;. The being says “he came to see the horses&quot; and the voice replys “this is not right. his time has not come yet. He has to go back&quot;. </p><p>As he doesn’t want to go back, he yells, cries to no avail. The voice laughs and says “look, you can come here later, but not now. It’s no use to be naughty&quot;. A hand helps him to go back through the tunnel and into his body. “why can’t I stay here&quot; he yells and the voice answers “there are some things you have to do&quot;.</p></blockquote></div><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>Patient 2 is 9 yrs old again and he nearly drawns near a seaside whe a giant vawe took him into the sea. He remembers the tunnel, thelight and a beautiful garden. While he reviews his short life, a very bright light – that he thinks God – is near him. He feels very happy there, he doesn’t want to go back but the light tells him he has to turn back.</p></blockquote></div><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>Patient 3 falls from stairs when he’s 4 yrs old. He remembers seeing his body lying on the ground in the dark room then he suddenly realizes the light. The light begins to shine more and this is a beautiful feeling he remembers. Then his mother comes in and takes his body to hospital where he turns to life.</p></blockquote></div><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>Patient 4 is under an operation when she feels herself elsewhere than hospital bed. There is a warm and loving light being near her, she thinks she’s happy to finish with the lifetime she came from. But the being disagrees “you haven’t stayed there enough&quot; it says. Then she begins to feel maybe there is something unfinished in her life. She feels really angry to have to get back to the body-prison. She only thought “maybe&quot;, she didn’t say she wanted to turn back, but the being made her turn back to her body.</p></blockquote></div><p>Now all these are very interesting stories when we look from WiH window. NDE is a subject which I never looked into because I always felt there’s something wrong with this tunnel-loving light story. It’s nearly the same with mainstream religious beliefs. <br />If we look at holy books – Old Testament and Quran – we see the God [who walks(!) in the Garden of Eden in afternoon breeze(!)] telling Adam &amp; Eve not to eat from Tree of Knowledge and then fire them out of Heaven. What kind of “loving &amp; caring&quot; creator does this to his creatures (as David Icke wrote)? And humanity worship this being! Here the same situation applies: the light beings are always “warm&quot;, “loving&quot;, “caring&quot; but always they FORCE people out of the beautiful environment they’re in (Patient 1 – Pt.2 – Pt.4). So there is something wrong in these stories. </p><p>Pt.3’s story is different, I took it because of this. There’s no being there, only the beauty of light-environment, possibly the astral plane. I think this may be the main feeling of that place, although WiH says astral plane is harsh and hostile environment. I’m not comfortable with lower astral/higher astral level teachings, the astral plane/universe must be just like earth itself – just a notral place or maybe condition. Of course every place on earth is not the same. E.g there are some beautiful parks, gardens and there are city junk yards, dirty &amp; dangerous suburbias full of street gangs. But mostly these are all about beings living there, not the place itself. If we take care of a garden, it becomes a good place, if we throw everything all around, it becomes a junk yard. When it comes to “light beings&quot; in astral plane, there’s always a friction with the NDE experiencer. The experiencer never wants to go back but “forced gently&quot; to turn. It is told “their job is not finished yet&quot;. C’mon people! Who are we working for? Pt.4’s story has some more interesting aspects. She is a nurse but she says she still cannot understand her “unfinished business&quot; here. She still tries to understand why she is forced to turn back. So we “work&quot; for some huge coorporations and they do not allow us to get out of the business till our working hours are over? Just like on earth? And we have some freelancer workers or home based workers who are more liberal than other spirits. They sometimes may cause problems for huge astral coorporations and sometimes work for these companies if paid properly? That’s why well-known occultists are not so trustable people? Maybe.</p><p>Also when I look at some of Quran’s verses which I didn’t give any meaning before, it makes some sense. As in <em>55:41 – The guilty shall be recognized by their marks, so they shall be seized by the forelocks and the feet </em>. This “mark&quot; story is also in some other sacred texts, I suppose. This may be a metaphor for lower vibrations, if the vibration is low then the Theos can “touch/seize&quot; the spirit and lock it to their band. </p><br /><p>Some more interesting points from Dr. Morse’s book: Another doctor who read Dr. Morse’s work has made similar study in his country, Zambia. He collected 15 NDE from Zambia’s rural regions. These people did not see “loving &amp; warm&quot; light or tunnels. They had various experiences as seeing some other people in white robes singing songs (when they see the NDE experiencer, they cut their song and say you’re not supposed to be here, turn back); a stairway to heaven (but when the experiencer tries to walk on that road, some “stars&quot; close his way); trapped in a giant pumpkin (some voice says “hold my hand&quot; and gets the experiencer out of the pumpkin) or seeing a man and a woman saying they will take the experiencer soon but not now. Their thoughts on these experiences are more interesting; they believe someone tried to put a spell on them but unsucceed so that they could turn back or they had seen some kind of bad omen. Dr. Morse says these stories from Zambia proves that NDE is a universal phenomenon. But when I look from WiH window again, these stories makes Theocracy Stages valid. These people do not have an organised, hierarchical religious systems but rather simpler beliefs about magic, spells, bad omens etc. They are not “plugged&quot; into the western culture Matrix to see light beings, loving lights or Jesus etc. So the culture we’re in really is iimportant. If we know a lot then it will not be easy to fool us with some images, if we ever re-member our real selves in the first minutes of afterlife. To put it more precisely; awareness protects – doesn’t matter whatever culture you’re in. </p><br /><br /><p>The possibilities, nearly endless possibilities. If WiH is right, these are Theocrats operating in Theocratic bands. But how do these bands give that warm &amp; loving feeling to all the souls? If we can ben fooled like that easily (ehm, in fact history tells so) what/who can we trust after life? </p><p>Or –&nbsp; as I began to think – this place, the astral plane that we immediately go after dying is really loving &amp; warm compared to 3D. But these so-called light beings – Theocrats – somehow rule this environment and make everything work for their interest. So unknowing and ignorant souls who are literally billions in number are recycled using a “gentle &amp; warm&quot; force as a huge energy source. </p><p>Another possibility; eveything in astral plane are just like earth life anyway. We just maybe beginner/intermediate souls who has to go to “schools&quot;. I remember waking up early was veeery difficult when I was in high-school. High school was a hostile environment full of challenges compared to my warm house. In the home my breakfast was always ready, I had my computer (a legendary Commodore 64!) and books and hot chocolate etc etc. The school had bullies (Theocrats?), exams, bad teachers (another set of Theocrats), boring lessons and rain-snow-cold weather etc. </p><p>Or the beings who channeled WiH are Theocrats themselves. They try to bait some bright, intelligent and researcher souls to feed upon. As they are very few in astral planes they do not need millions of souls, just a few hundred advanced souls are enough for them. They make this clever Theocrat – IC story and set their trap. I don’t think WiH story ever goes into mainstream. We are only a few reading &amp; studying all these. After dying we’ll avoid real light beings and run into Theos thinking they are the good guys. </p><p>Or WiH – IC story only represents very few importance in astral planes. How many of us here on NR are members of any political party? How many of us just attended to any particular political convention? This WiH story may just be a political party working against another. So they tell everything according to themselves. I can choose to go several places when I walk out of my house right now; a park, nearest building, a shopping place, a theatre, to my office, or to nearest political party building to work on some local politics about Istanbul. Astral plane works just this way, when you die there are a plenty of choices for you to go. But IC party is not happy how things work here and they reject the process “politically&quot;. As this is only politics, lots of beings are even not aware of Theocrats and IC’s on astral plane. These are just two political parties in an endless astral plane/universe anyway. Who in NR knows Turkey’s leading party now? <br />(FYI: It’s a conservative right wing party <img src="https://forum.noblerealms.org/img/smilies/roll.png" width="15" height="15" alt="roll" />)</p><p>So as can be seen from a brief summary (hope I could give what’s on my mind properly)&nbsp; the possibilities are so varied. This means more research &amp; more work for me!&nbsp; &nbsp;<img src="https://forum.noblerealms.org/img/smilies/yikes.png" width="15" height="15" alt="yikes" /></p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[feritciva]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=128</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2007-01-04T09:03:09Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=50080#p50080</id>
		</entry>
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