in the context the quote was taken, i think it's ment to demonstrate that the princible is a very simplified and un-coded/un-refined version of consciousness.

But I like that everyone's taking the quote and making such intelligent remarks from it. ^_^ click the first link from my original post for more from the same source. If you're at all a word nerd like myself, you'll enjoy it.

Algorithms
Begin with a function of arbitrary complexity. Feed it values,
"sense data". Then, take your result, square it, and feed it back
into your original function, adding a new set of sense data.
Continue to feed your results back into the original function ad
infinitum. What do you have? The fundamental principle of Pre-Sentient human
consciousness.

        -- Academician Prokhor Zakharov,
           "The Feedback Principle"

I respectfully submit my opinion on the matter by moving the word "Pre-Sentient" to a latter position.

This is how programs work, in such an external-focused box, not how human beings are meant to.  At least, we're not meant to stay there...  Imo this is how the matrix functions, on "sense data".

Osmedirez wrote:
[Pre-Sentient Algorithms
Begin with a function of arbitrary complexity. Feed it values,
"sense data". Then, take your result, square it, and feed it back
into your original function, adding a new set of sense data.
Continue to feed your results back into the original function ad
infinitum. What do you have? The fundamental principle of human
consciousness.

        -- Academician Prokhor Zakharov,
           "The Feedback Principle"

Yes, correct. I have always found the "Feedback Loop" explanation of Consciousness highly satisfactory, moreso because it doesn't explain away the phenomon, as the turgid philosophies and sciences of many do (inadvertently).

The Academician appears to be saying that consciousness is a chaos function. What he has not considered is that it may also be indeterminate and thus non-local.

[Pre-Sentient Algorithms
Begin with a function of arbitrary complexity. Feed it values,
"sense data". Then, take your result, square it, and feed it back
into your original function, adding a new set of sense data.
Continue to feed your results back into the original function ad
infinitum. What do you have? The fundamental principle of human
consciousness.

        -- Academician Prokhor Zakharov,
           "The Feedback Principle"

Yes, correct. I have always found the "Feedback Loop" explanation of Consciousness highly satisfactory, moreso because it doesn't explain away the phenomon, as the turgid philosophies and sciences of many do (inadvertently).

Pre-Sentient Algorithms
Begin with a function of arbitrary complexity. Feed it values,
"sense data". Then, take your result, square it, and feed it back
into your original function, adding a new set of sense data.
Continue to feed your results back into the original function ad
infinitum. What do you have? The fundamental principle of human
consciousness.

        -- Academician Prokhor Zakharov,
           "The Feedback Principle"

Good Article as previously ref'd: "Virtuality and Its Discontents"

I started to play World of Warcraft, and it is a fun game.

And to show the extreme effects this video game can have, along with a little bit of laughter see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8YpHtFS-GI

What's interesting about World of Warcraft is its shear popularity.  It currently has something like 7.5 million subscribers, that is massive for any medium - let only a niche online game.  With subscription fees in the range of $10+ per month that is a annual turnover of $900 million.

By the middle of next year, Warcraft will become the largest grossing entertainment medium of any format in history.  That means it will have taken more money than any movie franchise, any product such as the iPod, and out grossing any multi-million selling album (including the likes of Elvis Presley).

Now when you consider that the game and genre is still more or less a niche, and that the majority of people will have barely heard about it - then it is fantastic sums of money.  But what is generating such interest?  Are people really that desperate to escape this world and enter another?  I think it maybe difficult for people to understand the allure of this sort of thing if they haven't experienced it for themselves.  What appears as an average "game" literally take on a whole new level once the imagination is applied.

Experiences within these worlds can leave one feeling that those experiences were real.  People will scoff at that (in fact I can hear them doing so as they read), and people will say "But it isn't real, it's just escapism / un-important / control"

But the thing is, whilst it most certainly isn't real - the mind will remember it as being real.  The closest association I could make for people to relate to would be - think of a very vivid dream; it is like the recollection of such a dream, minus memory of any sensations.

It is totally an other worldly experience.  But then added into that are addiction trends, fashion concepts and all the control manipulations available within the real world.

People talk about gadget geeks with their iPods; there is a joke about it in the Pod People thread - i, Pod.  It is very apt.  Now extend that sort of product marketing; the manufactured belief that such an item is an important necessity (just like the whole craze around cell phones) and import that into a virtual world.  The levels that this can be taken to far exceed what is occurring in the real world; and this is one of the most vital things that keeps people hooked and coming back for more.

Lyra talks about her friend escaping this reality, into the game.  But what will he be doing in that game?  He will be on an endless treadmill to "improve" himself, repeating the same tasks over and over endlessly, to gather money, improve his possessions, increase in rank (being promoted), looking cool in front of his online friends by means of gathering (virtual) material wealth and so on.  It is in every way a copy of the manufactured system we live in.  Only it has been taken to such extremes that it is way, way beyond what we see on a day to day basis.

Before Warcraft there was a game called Everquest, instead of millions of subscribers this game had a few hundred thousand.  It was built on the same principle of material accumulation whist running on a daily treadmill.  The turnover within the games virtual economy - when based on an exchange rate with real world currency (US Dollars; based on the value of virtual wealth brought with real world currency) - showed that the games economy matched that of a third world nations yearly GNP.  As far as I know this sort of comparison hasn't yet been done with Warcraft and its millions of players.

Add into this, business models that are being set up that operate with one arm in these virtual worlds and the other in the physical world - then what is developing is totally fascinating.  (As well as worrying; think of the implications!!!)  As I mentioned before what is occurring with these games hasn't yet been fully recognised, not on a physical level, nor an economic level.  That aside, it's impact hasn't even been widely considered in metaphysical and spiritual circles.

As the technology grows though, it will become apparent to more and more people what is actually happening here.  For now though, most people are pretty blind to it because of the veil that these games get to hide behind.  i.e. one of un-important distraction etc.  Maybe it's similar to how TV and the Internet started of.  A few knew what was developing and what those things would become, most though really weren't paying attention.

That's yet another area of where these things are running.  People spend a lot of time looking where military technology is secretly applied.  Yet there is this tech out there right in front of everyone’s eyes.  It is behavioural altering - potentially far more so than TV - due to the ability of interaction and feedback.  Yet it is seemingly ignored.  It has great applications as you mention when applied in the right ways.  Though it seems to be that in order to be posititive, it requires a good level of personal discernment and judgement.

It will be interesting to see what happens when the next-generation of games like Warcraft come along boasting far more realism and end up attracting 70+ million customers.  Maybe when a single one of these virtual worlds ends up with a larger population than a real world country, more people will finally wake up to what is actually occurring here...

I agree with what's being said, although, like most things it is all about balence and discipline

You are 100% right!

Balance is what this world lacks most...

I have to confess that in the past I dismissed some dates to play video game... ahuuahuah
Not much times, just a few.

Nerd Pictus... Nerd... Nerd...

And to show the extreme effects this video game can have, along with a little bit of laughter see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8YpHtFS-GI

I agree with what's being said, although, like most things it is all about balence and discipline, and for me I have actually learned something from that game.  I think that games can teach us more about this game that we are playing, in other words the game on Earth.  For example, I've been into hockey ever since I was growing up and I've been noticing that the younger generations have been playing the games on their respected systems, and when they go to the rinks in the winter they are able to preform the tricks that were emulated in the game.  I think games are pushing our imaginations to greater hights - in some cases.  But alas, it has been taken to the extreme, but then again, it is a personal choice, so I am grateful that I have not fallen into the extreme, but am glad that we do have video games, because without them I could see more people turning over to alcohol and drugs and other forms of escapism.

Because whether it's a real world or not, whether that "character" is just an avatar, or an extension of yourself projected into a (lower) reality / density...it all soon starts to feel very real.  I personally feel that what is going on with these online games is not very well understood, and that far more is going on than is readily apparent.  And not necessarily in a good way.

Disconnecting yourself from this reality, blacking out days or rushing through life just to get back to "the game" can't be good on any level.  I personally know people that have messed up relationships due to those games.  I know one guy that quit his job, just so that be could play his game 16 - 20 hours a day, simply so that he could get to the top of the worlds leader board.

One thing that I do find strange though, is how into exploring these virtual environments people can be.  Don't get me wrong I have spent my fair share of hours roaming virtual worlds, but not at the expense of this world.  I love nature and walking, and exploring and nothing can beat or replace doing that in reality.

Yet people I know who have no interest in nature, or walking or exploring.  People who wouldn't even care if they lived in a 100% urban city - simply because they "don't see the point" of nature, or have no interest in it; these people are totally awed by replications of environments in these games...

Sure it looks quite impressive as far as these things go, but it has nothing on reality.  But then in reality you can't just up at any moment and run up a mountain and jump from the top.  Or swim across a sea to get to another continent.  The experience doesn't match life - but I can see (and I have felt) the draw of it all.

I think a closer look needs to be taken at just what is occurring with these games.  Because as technology moves on, the worlds will eventually get to the point where they are indistinguishable from the "real" world.  People will without a doubt want to live there lives out in such a world.  That certainly seems odd - but the implications are far reaching.  At what point does a manufactured reality become "real"?  From many points of view there is a lot to the physical worlds reality that isn't real.  When enough people believe a virtual world is real, and live as though it is real - and when that world becomes indistinguishable from this world...what will happen?  We are on that road right now and have been for the last 10 years or so...I wonder where it is all going.

Right now there are "games" out there that basically have cost of living in them.  They require real world money to inhabit and live.  Virtual money can be exchanged for real world money.  As people invest themselves financially, physically and emotionally more and more into these worlds - ultimately their fates become controllable by the flick of a switch or the change of some code.  Intriguing possibilities as far as I see it.  Though certainly not good - not for the purposes the technology is currently being used for at least.

It’s something I have removed myself from – it’s not a direction I want to head in.  But for a lot of people the opposite is true, and they are following that path wherever it is taking them.

Hey, I'm spending much too much time online at this virtual forum!

I wonder if they think about the past and think that in a few months, these game devices will be on the shelf, where you can walk up to it, take it down and walk calmly to the register.

Ha, good point.  Seriously! 

I used to have a friend back in California named Mike that I've mentioned here and there on NR, and he was always the kind of guy that was retreated from the world, a self-proclaimed hermit who lived online practically, but by the end of my time in Cali, he became completely weird.   OBSESSIVE computer game player, who loved to play those online games where hundreds of people are logged in, playing "their character."    It was just so bad that I used to joke to myself that if he could be permanently attached to some pod devise with an intravenous drip feed and waste removal tube and never have to actually take part in the "real world," then he would.  He was just THAT BAD.  He plowed through his work day, something that was so unappealing and miserable to him that he often times actually blacked out entire days, not remembering driving to or from work at all, and did most of his shopping online, further insuring the need to not have to leave his apartment, all so that he could get back to "his game."  Life revolved around whatever game of the moment he was involved in and making sure to spend as much time as humanly possible at home, parked in front of that computer.   He didn't seek people out or make an effort to call his family or friends, rarely returned emails.  He made people go to him, and by the end, it was clearly a case of interrupting his game time.  He just got weeeeird.

Those few times I've connected back up with him since leaving Cali the conversation usually excitedly mentions whatever game he's involved in, or gaming system he just bought or received as a gift.  The last email I got from him several months ago, there was the brief opening sentence.......an entire paragraph centered around the game/game system of the moment that he received as a gift from his brother-in-law, a fellow gamer...and then the short closing sentence.

Ya.   He did somehow manage to get married though two years ago, became social long enough to find a wife, and they do seem perfectly matched for each other.  He forwarded me their MySpace links, so I was perusing their profiles and saw that two of her three blog entries center around gaming system discussion, with lingo that makes no sense to me, it's a language in itself.

She does make a "joke" though that she started playing computer games "because I was tired of competing with the computer for Mike's attention lol." 

Another blog entry that's no longer there, must have been deleted, mentioning waiting in line for hours "for the fucker."  Fucker being the game, not Mike! 

Point of all this being................................I don't think there's anything anybody CAN say to these people.  They have deliberately chosen this.   They don't want to be involved in whatever we may be involved with.   They don't want to do anything else.   In Mike's case, he's seen the world, and it wasn't appealing to him.  Walks in nature, quiet time being "unplugged," traveling around and road trips, creative non-computer related hobbies......he had no lust for most any of it, it did nothing for him.   So he retreated away into his life of games and just turned himself off.   I think either people get involved with this stuff to this level because they're empty inside, or because something has broken and they no longer want to be a part of this world.   Escapism.  The alternate to suicide.