I hope no one minds me resurrecting this thread

OK, here's what I thought was good about the material. It emphasises your personal connection to the Divine, and the importance of looking for the source of truth and divinity within yourself rather than relying on outer gurus, mediators, etc. Also states that "the battle" is an internal one, on a personal level. There will be no mass ascension, no external saviour - you save yourself. This is all good and rings true to me.

...Well anyway, that's my contribution, I don't know if anyone cares.

I don't mind. And I do care about what you have to say. Finally, I totally agree with your remark about saving yourself. I think that's the good and true stuff in that post.

Also just to clarify, I don't doubt that some sort of divine law exists and that it is in our best interest to abide by it, I just objected to how "Insider" portrayed it. For one thing, he claims or at least implies that the elite are acting within/supported by this divine law, which I highly doubt. And secondly, I disagree with the idea that everything is inevitable and set in stone, that we're all just playing predetermined roles - surely that would negate the whole concept of free will? Anyway, overall I must say I still get bad vibes from this material. Despite the fact that I agree with a lot of what he says, there's something about it/him that gives me the creeps.

- States that all well-known historical/spiritual figures, Jesus, Buddha, Einstein, you name it, were more or less "puppets" just acting out their role - they did exactly what they were supposed to do, according to so-called "Divine Law". Well, this all sounds a bit too fatalistic to me. What about free will? Does that not come into play at all? Or is everything all just predetermined, inevitable, set in stone, there's nothing you can do about it anyway 'cause you're just mechanically acting out your role as defined by someone/something else? Hmm.

- Like others here, I thought his assertion that a poster would receive more incarnations for what they said was pretty ludicrous. Plus the fact he repeatedly wrote "I had to be very careful how I said that" in parentheses after certain statements. What's the implication? That there's a punishment from on high for saying something in the wrong way, not wording a sentence correctly, etc.? A few more rounds on the wheel of rebirth? Ridiculous. If the Divine is offended by anything that mere human beings can say, then It's pretty lame in my opinion. This sounds like what Christians say about people who blaspheme going to hell - it's just a variation on that.

- This is the big one, for me...the subtle (or not-so-subtle) message interwoven in the Insider material is this: that the power elite are not that bad really, they're just doing what they should be doing according to Divine Law (that again ), they're the good guys and we the people are the stupid, ignorant ones believing the lies and perpetuating the illusion so we deserve everything we get. Once again, I call BS. Could it be that now people are starting to wake up to the reality of the power elite, the elite realise they can no longer hide as easily behind their veil of secrecy and so have devised a new tactic of trying to spread the disinfo that they're the good guys fulfilling their duty, mandated by God's law? That we need them somehow because we're too stupid to run the world by ourselves? It's like the dubious idea that "evil" is somehow a necessary counterbalance to "good". I expect even the devil would claim that he's serving some greater holy purpose for God in the scheme of things. Do they truly believe their own lies, or is the deception intentional?...

...Well anyway, that's my contribution, I don't know if anyone cares. Actually I'm probably completely talking to myself here, haha. I just had to get my thoughts out because I've been pondering this all day. Feel free to ignore my ramblings if you don't wanna keep dredging up an old thread.

Thanks for bringing this thread back Daisy, I think it's one of the more interesting ones, and I've been away for so long, it's one of the last ones I got into before I went, so it's almost "coincidental" that it's been brought back up!

I can see that this guy does have some knowledge, but as you say, some is definitely disinfo. Divine Law is something that transcends this worldly experience and follows us through the whole journey, (which doesn't end with this life) and I'm really grateful that it does, since things would be completely screwed if it wasn't in play, but trying to explain it is difficult, since language is a major barrier. It kinda goes into your second point though, since I know that translating my thoughts into words is difficult enough for me, so how would I do so for you so you could see the concepts that I have no words for? In these sorts of cases, even a small variance or a slight inflection of meaning can lead to major difficulties down the road, and often those differences are exploited by those able to see the truth, but who choose to use it to their own benefit (usually 3/4DSTS)

Maybe I'm breaking some rules that I don't know about, (lol) but try and see how this works. Imagine that there is something that is so profound that it encompasses EVERYTHING that you could ever imagine and more. Even the bad stuff is in there, but it's in a different form, because there is nothing "bad/evil/wrong" about this concept, since it's been able to remove all such energetically draining ties from itself by passing them to other expressions (lifetimes) and only retaining the lessons learned by the experiences coupled with the eureka/love that accompanies each addition as it moves closer to completion. From a human perspective, we can never come close to attaining this state of being, not because we don't wish for it enough, or that we are somehow bad/evil/sinful/flawed, but because our physical form just isn't meant for it.

I need to drop back a bit and go into the Garden of Eden parable a bit. (and give out a bit of Gnostic stuff here too) The Demiurge tells Adam and Eve that they can stay in the garden blissfully immortal as long as they don't eat this apple. The problem is that within this apple is the knowledge that is required for mankind to evolve into a being free from the Demiurge. If you think about this a bit, what was being said is that if man chooses to remain in an animal state he will live forever, but by choosing to evolve, he loses the favor of the Demiurge, and gets cast out of the Garden to learn about limitation. (which is probably the lesson that the Demiurge choose to skip) The problem is that for transcendence to occur, man must be in a position to resonate within an absolute singularity, but this is directly in opposition with what our human experience is all about, especially since no examples exist which can be directly apprehended by a functionally sane individual.

Ultimately, the objective is to find a way back, not to the recycling stage after death, but past it and into the presence of the Unknowable One, but the problem is that there are no ways to direct others to their path (which is different for each individual!) but if you could understand that where we begin to diverge from this state is when we accept the blessing granted by freewill. We are here to learn, and are given the ability to diverge from what is "right" but even then, the "wrong" we do is made to service the one running the whole show regardless of what it is! This is what separates us from the animal kingdom. (and the 2D limitations that the Demiurge sought to impose upon us!) What I hypothesize is that when a specific critical mass is reached, those who are able in this lifetime (along with those waiting outside time) will be elevated to the presence of the Unknowable One, and having surpassed the Demiurge, will no longer have any need of it, and can move on to the next stage of our journey, which is truly fantastic! (from the upcoming perspective, what we perceive as this "life" is actually truly closer to "dream/sleep/death" and when we awaken we will truly know what it is to be alive - it is nothing like anything anyone could ever imagine, as the mere concepts defy any linguistic explanation that I could express.

So for your first question, concerning the roles played by various spiritual leaders throughout history - they ARE just roles sent by the Unknowable One to teach us the truth and to show us the way to escape the Demiurge, and to achieve a reunion with itself. There exists a place outside of time where these individuals exist and where we are connected to them by a common energetic thread. They are us in a way, only more spiritually developed than we are now, and their mission is to bring us along to where they are when we're able and ready to handle it. The interesting thing is that even THEY are bound by Divine Law, but since they choose to act within it, they do not hinder their own progress.

As for getting more incarnations, this just doesn't make much sense, unless we're talking about a hi-level STS wanting to squeeze out a bit more life. (much like some mega millionaire spending millions of dollars in exchange for 6 months of life confined to a hospital bed while in excruciating pain) This is actually close to the truth, since once changes occur which liberate those of us able to go on, they will have no more purpose and nothing left to feed on. That they know the truth and are just doing their jobs actually makes sense, but it only confirms a deep STS profile, since they can only see themselves as being justified in taking advantage of others for personal profit, instead of guiding them along for common benefit. They also know that there really is no escape, and what the insider is saying only confirms that they are also subject to Divine Law and are (rightfully) terrified!

Hope my perspective helps a bit,

-3G

OK, here's what I thought was good about the material. It emphasises your personal connection to the Divine, and the importance of looking for the source of truth and divinity within yourself rather than relying on outer gurus, mediators, etc. Also states that "the battle" is an internal one, on a personal level. There will be no mass ascension, no external saviour - you save yourself. This is all good and rings true to me.

However, I do think that the labelling of all gurus and teachers as untrustworthy is wrong and goes too far into the extreme. The true teacher serves one purpose, and that is to help you reconnect to your spiritual self, to the divine within. They simply point the way, and what's bad about that? Thus, what Insider said is, for me, a subtle distortion of the truth.

Other things that seem "off" about the material:

- States that all well-known historical/spiritual figures, Jesus, Buddha, Einstein, you name it, were more or less "puppets" just acting out their role - they did exactly what they were supposed to do, according to so-called "Divine Law". Well, this all sounds a bit too fatalistic to me. What about free will? Does that not come into play at all? Or is everything all just predetermined, inevitable, set in stone, there's nothing you can do about it anyway 'cause you're just mechanically acting out your role as defined by someone/something else? Hmm.

- Like others here, I thought his assertion that a poster would receive more incarnations for what they said was pretty ludicrous. Plus the fact he repeatedly wrote "I had to be very careful how I said that" in parentheses after certain statements. What's the implication? That there's a punishment from on high for saying something in the wrong way, not wording a sentence correctly, etc.? A few more rounds on the wheel of rebirth? Ridiculous. If the Divine is offended by anything that mere human beings can say, then It's pretty lame in my opinion. This sounds like what Christians say about people who blaspheme going to hell - it's just a variation on that.

- This is the big one, for me...the subtle (or not-so-subtle) message interwoven in the Insider material is this: that the power elite are not that bad really, they're just doing what they should be doing according to Divine Law (that again ), they're the good guys and we the people are the stupid, ignorant ones believing the lies and perpetuating the illusion so we deserve everything we get. Once again, I call BS. Could it be that now people are starting to wake up to the reality of the power elite, the elite realise they can no longer hide as easily behind their veil of secrecy and so have devised a new tactic of trying to spread the disinfo that they're the good guys fulfilling their duty, mandated by God's law? That we need them somehow because we're too stupid to run the world by ourselves? It's like the dubious idea that "evil" is somehow a necessary counterbalance to "good". I expect even the devil would claim that he's serving some greater holy purpose for God in the scheme of things. Do they truly believe their own lies, or is the deception intentional?...

So overall I conclude, as have previous posters in this thread, that this information is a mixture of truth tangled with lies, once again highlighting the importance of using one's spiritual discernment as well as a healthy dose of critical thinking. Considering the source of any information is part of this (although note I'm not saying you should let the messenger obscure the message, because any source can help you to realise truth...) I mean, in this case, if this person really is an "Elite insider" then why would they give us the complete honest truth? "Because I can", as he said, is not really a satisfactory explanation. It's like when people present information that has been channelled to them by self-professed demons, and I'm thinking, "Why would anyone trust this information? It's from a demon for God's sake!" So yeah...source is important.

...Well anyway, that's my contribution, I don't know if anyone cares. Actually I'm probably completely talking to myself here, haha. I just had to get my thoughts out because I've been pondering this all day. Feel free to ignore my ramblings if you don't wanna keep dredging up an old thread.

Hmm, "Insider" commenting that the questioner would recieve extra incarnations for what he had said ruined his credibility, IMHO.

That's what got me. Why did the questioner supposedly get those extra incarnations? I assumed two things- either the questioner offended the Divine Will, which is pretty crazy because isn't the Divine Will like the One or is the One? The One simply cannot being offended, be tainted, be wanting, etc. It simply is, so logically my first assumption doesn't work. Or the Insider did get offended and pulled that crape off to scare the questioner? The questioner has free will right? So even if the Insider tried to get the questioner after his death to reincarnate and he didn't want to, well there isn't a damn thing the Insider could do about it!

I always remembered that comment above all others in that file. Something seemed off about it, like the Insider for one moment lost his aristocratic cool and snapped out at one of the questioners.

As for the entire material the main message I got is that this prison has been designed for your benefit ultimately and your final goal and the meaning of your existence is to get out of it. Also that you really are responsible for everything in your reality, and that perhaps fighting and bitching about the TPTb was pointless and that they had a role for you too.

What shook me was the idea that Buddha, Jesus, etc. were actually used/guided by the TPTB to some sort of end, and they were made to believe they had made it but were in fact wrong! As the Insider himself said every religion has a core of truth but awash in a sea of perversions, it is very likely that Insider's own material falls under this rule. Cores of truth in what he says, but awash in lies and perversions.

He was also a well respected Egyptian archaelogist, on one of his sites he had many photos of various sites around Egypt. 

He used robots.txt on his websites so none of them can be found on the Wayback machine.

Do people who have these skills become deranged ? That would depend on whether they sided with the reptilians or not or whether the reptilians felt that person might be a danger to their agenda.

Pellucidar,
I think that the guy is probably a really adept (in every sense of the word) psi "master" or whatever they are called now, but his philosophy seems very skewed. He has all these plans to save the world by remote piping in spiritually elevating harmonics to large populated areas (without the permission of the individuals involved, I take it), he talks about morality and ethics, but he has absolutely no qualms or conscience about mind-control seduction and magnetizing  and creating lust in other people without their awareness being involved. Hmmm...
Do you think that by the very nature of exercising all of these psi and remote influencing entrainment skills a person becomes deranged? Because he sounds like a very powerful magician, but he comes off as very STS. He is very smart and clever, but unscrupulous in his use of knowledge. And I hope he never reads this post and gets a lock on me!  But, I do like to know what people are up to, and thanks for the info-lala

try the above download lala

Thanks, Pellucidar, I do believe that I've been the target of radionics remote influencing. How do you clear these implanted thoughts? How do you recognize them?-lala

And treehugger: Thank you, that was so very helpful. I am understanding a lot of things that have been going on in my life from what people are saying. For one thing, I see that if a person is into this
EcK stuff, they are basically an open relay for really manipulative people with strong psi powers. This is why I haven't been able to work constructively in a certain group that I was involved in. The Eck person was always a puppet of an egotistical STS manipulator. That would fit.-lala

Pleidian Healer wrote several pages back:

You could soul travel while sitting up meditating in a chair (which is the method taught by Eckankar).    They have you chant the name of the man who's the "master" in Eckankar, who at this time is Harold Klemp (the last time I checked anyway).   I can't remember his spiritual name, which is his soul name, but just as an example, let's say his soul name is Mahatma.   What they teach is that you sit upright, relax and chant the name Mahatma over and over, with your eyes closed and also with ALL of your focus and concentration on your third-eye/6th chakra.

Is Eckankar a good way to learn soul travel? Because most of the people I've ever met who are into it seem to be disociative in some eery kind of way. Does anyone know more about them? Are they a cult?

Pellucidar wrote:

Yet another technique used by few homeopaths involves using "a paper remedy. Write the remedy and potency on a piece of paper and place the paper on the left hand side of the body with the writing towards the body." One homeopath, "finds out what they need, writes the remedy down on a piece of paper, they put it in their pocket and it works." In essence, this comprises an emerging alternative homeopathic tradition, "`paper remedies' i.e., a name of a remedy just written on a piece of paper."

and also wrote about radionics machines. I had a dream that someone (whom I told to not have any contact with me) wrote a message on paper and put it in the well of a machine. Could I have been picking up a real event on the astral plane of a person sending me a message by radionics machine?

-lala

Lala;
I joined Eckankar back in the early '80's.  I guess it would have been considered a "new age religion" back  at that time. I was only involved with it for about 4 yrs.   The thing with Eckankar..1. you had to pay $ for the discourses at that time. You were told you could share it with family members, but no one else, or any spiritual headway you made would instantly be wiped away. 2. Once you made 2nd initiation, which was done after 2yrs of the discourses, you were asked to teach satsang classes. Plus write a written report to the Mahanta, or Living Eck master ( who I believe is still Harold Klemp) once a month. 3. Paul Twitchell who founded Eckankar, basically stole  most everthing from other belief systems. Not good for people that were really into it, to find out your whole belief system was ripped off and thrown together. 4. You are also told, that if you leaave the path of Eck, you will have a very shitty life, because the Mahanta will no longer protect you.5.They talked about not needing a church in order to commune with the Sugmad (god), yet they built a huge, expensive, temple in Minnesota. 6. Followers were encouraged to attend the conventions, to recieve, the "darshan", which is recieved from the gaze of the living eck master. I guess, sort of an energy exchange. You were also encouraged to keep a photo of him around the house. How icky is that??

The whole basis of learning "soul travel" was to learn to navigate the astral realms and above, with the Mahanta's guidance, so that when you died, you could avoid the "wheel of karma", or reincarnation, and all the other trappings in the other realms.  Yes, you meditated while sitting up, just like in other meditation techniques. The difference is, you are traveling around in your soul body, instead of your astral body. I will say this, I had some interesting adventures in other realms, very lucid dreams. The second yr of discourse, is strictly on dreams.  My leaving was because of the restrictions and the contradictions that kept coming up. Plus, things just didnt seem right, and my intuition was telling me to move on. When I reached my second intitiation (you have one on the inner, and one on the outer with a Madhi, a person of the fifth intiation) they sent me a pink paper, saying Ive reached my intiation (I had it on the inner first, thats when you notify "headquarters" that your ready for the outer)and had all these RULES, and Im thinking, WTF! Plus  while reading Twitchell's books, I noticed there were just too many tiimes he contradicted himself. A lot to me was not making sense, and quite frankly, a lot of it was unattainable for someone living in this 3d realm.  Just like anything else, I think there were truths thrown in here and there. And I did gain some valuable experience and insight that I might not have otherwise.  Twitchell brought all this out in the '60's, and some of his works, pertaining to the astral realms, match up with some things that Kyle Griffith says in WIH.
Hope that helped.