<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>
<feed xmlns="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom">
	<title type="html"><![CDATA[Noble Realms — Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
	<link rel="self" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/extern.php?action=feed&amp;tid=3348&amp;type=atom" />
	<updated>2007-04-26T01:36:37Z</updated>
	<generator>PunBB</generator>
	<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?id=3348</id>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56353#p56353" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>Hey, it&#039;s this old thread.&nbsp; Cool beans.</p><p>Nexus, thanks for the very thought out response.&nbsp; I don&#039;t have anything specific to add.&nbsp; My focus has changed somewhat since I made this thread.</p><p>Titmouse, that&#039;s the quote that I was thinking about when I was making that &quot;Father&quot; poem on my other thread.&nbsp; That quote is burned forever into my mind.</p><p>This part here &quot;And, as we let our own light shine we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.&quot;, is what I think about each time I hear about anything related to letting our light shine.&nbsp; That statement helped me find the truth in &quot;sending love and light&quot; which I still agree is an imposition of free-will.&nbsp; It&#039;s not about sending love n light.&nbsp; It&#039;s about BEING your own light, which will &quot;unconsciously give other people permission to do the same&quot;.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[z3n3rg]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=945</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2007-04-26T01:36:37Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56353#p56353</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56326#p56326" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>I hope this thought is a contribution to this thread. <img src="https://forum.noblerealms.org/img/smilies/smile.png" width="15" height="15" alt="smile" /></p><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>&quot;Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate.&nbsp; Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure.&nbsp; It is our light, not our darkness, that most frightens us.&nbsp; We ask ourselves, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented and fabulous?&nbsp; Actually, who are you not to be? You are a child of God.&nbsp; Your playing small does not serve the world.&nbsp; There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won&#039;t feel insecure around you.&nbsp; We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us.&nbsp; It is not just in some of us; it is in everyone.&nbsp; And, as we let our own light shine we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.&nbsp; As we are liberated from our own fears, our presence automatically liberates others.&quot;</p><p>Nelson Mandela, 1994 Inaugural speech</p></blockquote></div>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[titmouse_]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=1009</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2007-04-25T19:44:43Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56326#p56326</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56323#p56323" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>I haven&#039;t yet worked out how to quote yet so i can just paraphrase a few posts.&nbsp; Hope thats ok.&nbsp; I love this thread and i love the questions and agree with so much of the conclusions made and which it&#039;s all evolving towards.&nbsp; I find the language in the descriptions of these concepts very different to my own but once i got all the abreviations i was rapt. &quot; A rose by any other name is just as sweet &quot;</p><p>z3n3rg i saw you refer to the base chakra as red colored.&nbsp; A fair bit of the esoteric literature over the past 130 yrs or so depicts the chakras as they are now, not as they are supposed to be.&nbsp; So all the colors of all the chakras are shown in people as they have become after falling into a lower state of conciousness,&nbsp; not as they were originally created.&nbsp; &nbsp;A purified base chakra is pure white.&nbsp; It has 4 petals and moves [turns] to the rythm of 4/4 timing.&nbsp; [eg the marching beats]&nbsp; After ages of incarnations it&#039;s colour has been distorted in the majority of people by misqualifying the spiritual energies in that chakra.&nbsp; [ the mother light ].&nbsp; &nbsp; These energies should be naturally rising up the cadeucus to nourish our higher chakras... ie.&nbsp; &nbsp;the seat of the soul chakra, the solar plexus,&nbsp; the heart chakra , throat chakra, third eye and crown chakras.</p><p>Instead the lifeforce in the base chakra has been diverted into &#039;lower passions&#039; over the millenia, as it has in all the other chakras.&nbsp; &nbsp; In all that time God only knows where we&#039;ve been.&nbsp; These energies&nbsp; [passions]&nbsp; have expressed as varous hues of red and have accumulated as an overlay to the 4 petalled base chakra.&nbsp; As in all the chakras,&nbsp; these energies can be transmuted back into their original lightforms,&nbsp; and the chakras can fully function as they were intended.&nbsp; When each of these 7 major Chakras have been purified they naturally express the rainbow rays of spiritual light which they once did.&nbsp; They each have a specific, different number of petals and are each&nbsp; intended to emit a uniquely beautiful high frequency energy ...aka... love.&nbsp; &nbsp;</p><p>z3n3rg also states that&nbsp; &quot;Light is information.&quot;&nbsp; &nbsp;True...I think we can say &quot; Light is information &quot; if we acknowlege that in essence Light is conciousness and that everything that was ever&nbsp; &#039;made&#039;&nbsp; came&nbsp; from conciousness.&nbsp; &nbsp;Therefore Light is IN....&nbsp; FORMATION... ie.&nbsp; &nbsp;Light has been &#039;clothed&#039; in form in the material universe.&nbsp; This naturally includes us, our bodies, our world.&nbsp; &nbsp;Also, as everyone knows,&nbsp; light can be encoded with information as in our communications technology&nbsp; through fiber optics...&nbsp; a physical reflection higher reality.&nbsp; <br />IN the 18th century, Issac Newton discovered that if you pass white light through a prism [ a crystal or glass pyramid shape ] it will refract into&nbsp; distinctly separate vibrations of light,&nbsp; each expressed as the colors of the rainbow rays.&nbsp; &nbsp;</p><p>Same thing happens with ourselves.&nbsp; &nbsp;In response to our inner attention [ and sometimes just out of the blue ]&nbsp; the spiritual white light descends from our Higher I AM Presence level,&nbsp; then,&nbsp; through the &quot;prism&quot; of the &#039;mediator&#039; which is our inner Christ conciousness it is refracted through to our own chakras in 7 identifyable&nbsp; rays.&nbsp; But in our current state,&nbsp; this &#039;river of life&#039; flowing through us has become a trickle... damned up by the untransmuted substance in our chakras.&nbsp; As we begin to self discipline our lives and use the Science of The Spoken Word we can greatly accelerate the process of transmutation and restore this flow.&nbsp; </p><p>We ourselves, as spiritual alchemists can transmutes the &quot;lead&quot; weight our&nbsp; lower conciousness back into the &quot;gold&quot; of the spiritual conciousness step by step.&nbsp; This is not a pie in the sky.&nbsp; It&#039;s a divine science and a divine art that we can master.&nbsp; z3n3rg...&nbsp; &nbsp;Visualizing the light is not profitless if it causes you to &quot;feel light&quot;.&nbsp; Feeling light is a manifestation of one&#039;s light self... It&#039;s not too over the top to say that through that experience one experiences gnosis.. Self Knowlege.&nbsp; Is it the ultimate in self knowlege?&nbsp; No... But not many people in this world can prove even that simple realisation of self.&nbsp; It could manifest as a feeling of joy or it could be a feeling of &#039;divine sadness&#039; but i would&#039;nt underestimate the power of that experience to motivate a person to seek closer and closer oneness with that light.</p><p>And maybe Montalk.... &quot;Ms&quot;.quote... &quot;until the Master returns home&quot;&nbsp; &nbsp;from &#039;The Fourth Way&#039; could mean when the Higher Self &#039;returns&#039; for the soul [ i have&#039;nt read the quote in context so it could reveal something else].&nbsp; That time is now. It really is an unusual spiritual opportunity when the inner Christ self&nbsp; draws closer than normal.&nbsp; It&#039;s the culmination of an ages old promise which picked up greater &#039;pace&#039; over a century ago with some&nbsp; being sponsored during that time to help prepare us with spiritual self knowlege.&nbsp; It&#039;s such a cornucopia we could almost take it for granted [ NRers excluded i hope]. </p><p>&nbsp; The Higher Self is at home in the&nbsp; &quot;householder&quot; as Yogananda would&nbsp; have put it.&nbsp; &nbsp; The inner Christ returns [ call it another name if you will] breathes the breath of life upon the coals of your chakras and and restores life to the &#039;house of the lord&#039;.&nbsp; The coals/chakras now become glowing embers and next...a flame, sometimes seen sometimes obscured, but all the while consuming,&nbsp; transmuting the substance of the centuries... alchemically changing energy from one form into another within you.<br />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;<br />For more info on this see a website i love : <a href="http://www.shangrala.org">www.shangrala.org</a></p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[nexus]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=1318</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2007-04-25T18:50:09Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56323#p56323</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37904#p37904" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>fandango wrote:</cite><blockquote><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>In order for a soul to make it back to 6d would they already have had to have been from there as one of the first thought-form-units created by the universe?</p></blockquote></div><p>IF the soul was not a &#039;first&#039;thought form unit, could it not be a second or 1 mth&nbsp; thought form unit?</p></blockquote></div><p>I was referring to &quot;first&quot; as a split right off the Source.&nbsp; Not a sequential usage of the term &quot;first&quot;.&nbsp; Is that what you meant?</p><br /><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>I recently read that the mystery of life is examimning all that you know and all that can be known, and seeing there remains a paradox in the universe; namely, that something came from nothing. It is ultimately understanding that this is NOT a paradox that enables the truth of the universe to settle within us. I can&#039;t recall who said it.</p></blockquote></div><p>Creating space seems to work for me.&nbsp; I like that particular paradox though.&nbsp; It&#039;s one that a large number of people have pondered. The religious &quot;Who created God?&quot; question.&nbsp; It&#039;s a fun one.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[z3n3rg]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=945</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-24T05:44:42Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37904#p37904</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37903#p37903" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>fandango wrote:</cite><blockquote><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>If that first paragraph can cause an emotional reaction</p></blockquote></div><p>It would be rare indeed for two human beings to have a communication without any emotion emitting.</p></blockquote></div><p>Sounds reasonable.&nbsp; Never had that angle of thought about it.</p><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>In fact one might postulate that such an event or even goal, is meaningless.</p></blockquote></div><p>I agree such a goal would be meaningless.&nbsp; The event would have meaning to me if I did it with a purpose in mind.</p><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>We have an intellect, we have a spirit, we have a body, we have emotions. They are all tools to enable us to soak up experiences. When one dominates the experience is distorted and is likely to be re-presented in one form or other. That we do not consciously intend something when we write, act or speak does not mean we did not subconsciously intend it. This is why our communication with ourselves must go deeper than the surface.</p></blockquote></div><p>True enough.&nbsp; I&#039;m not sure if you are referring to something specific.</p><div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>As I said I read your post in its entirety, with no tears in my eyes or anger in my heart to evoke a suggestion that emotion alone was driving that particular response. I was, if you like, in observation mode.</p></blockquote></div><p>I appreciate your observations.&nbsp; I wasn&#039;t really expecting conversation about the introduction.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[z3n3rg]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=945</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-24T05:32:16Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37903#p37903</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37878#p37878" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>In order for a soul to make it back to 6d would they already have had to have been from there as one of the first thought-form-units created by the universe?</p></blockquote></div><p>IF the soul was not a &#039;first&#039;thought form unit, could it not be a second or 1 mth&nbsp; thought form unit? I recently read that the mystery of life is examimning all that you know and all that can be known, and seeing there remains a paradox in the universe; namely, that something came from nothing. It is ultimately understanding that this is NOT a paradox that enables the truth of the universe to settle within us. I can&#039;t recall who said it.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[fandango]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=990</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-23T19:09:32Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37878#p37878</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37877#p37877" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><blockquote><p>If that first paragraph can cause an emotional reaction</p></blockquote></div><p>It would be rare indeed for two human beings to have a communication without any emotion emitting. In fact one might postulate that such an event or even goal, is meaningless. We have an intellect, we have a spirit, we have a body, we have emotions. They are all tools to enable us to soak up experiences. When one dominates the experience is distorted and is likely to be re-presented in one form or other. That we do not consciously intend something when we write, act or speak does not mean we did not subconsciously intend it. This is why our communication with ourselves must go deeper than the surface.</p><p>As I said I read your post in its entirety, with no tears in my eyes or anger in my heart to evoke a suggestion that emotion alone was driving that particular response. I was, if you like, in observation mode.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[fandango]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=990</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-23T19:06:25Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37877#p37877</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37090#p37090" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>Montalk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>an efficient use of the &quot;yellow ray&quot; and &quot;orange ray&quot; energies to such intensity that it puts the entity in contact with &quot;intelligent infinity&quot;</p></blockquote></div><div class="quotebox"><cite>Montalk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>3D entities who are to become 4D STS must not only lower their FRV but intensify its amplitude so that it rings loud and heavy</p></blockquote></div><div class="quotebox"><cite>Ra wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>...for after fifth-density graduation <em>wisdom is available</em> but must be <br />matched with an equal amount of love. This love/light is very, very difficult<br />to achieve in unity when following the negative path and during the earlier<br />part of the sixth-density, society complexes of the negative orientation will<br />choose to release the potential and leap into the sixth-positive.</p></blockquote></div><div class="quotebox"><cite>Ra wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>The sixth-density negative entity is extremely wise.</p></blockquote></div><div class="quotebox"><cite>montalk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>The point of this is to show that even without access to the higher centers it may still be possible to transcend 3D, but the perverted nature of that technique eventually catches up with the entity when its gravity increases to the point of implosion upon reaching the 5D/6D threshold.</p></blockquote></div><p>&#039;3d to 4d&#039; STS graduation makes sense.&nbsp; But what about &#039;4d to 5d&#039; and &#039;5d to 6d&#039;?</p><p>Can an entity utilize the lower rays (L.E.) in such force as to graduate another realm and make it to 5d?</p><p>Can the wisdom needed to advance to 6d STS be obtained without use of or having developed a Higher Intellectual Center?&nbsp; Can it be simply emulation of existing STS systems?&nbsp; For instance, an advanced computer architecture that emulates intelligence by stacking many systems on systems and connecting those systems in different ways.&nbsp; Here are some more quotes.</p><div class="quotebox"><cite>Cass (Dec 5, 1994) wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Q: (L) Are the 6th density Orions known as Transient Passengers? <br />A: Yes. <br />Q: (L) So there are Transient Passengers that are STO as well as STS? <br />A: TP is &quot;wanderer&quot;. <br />Q: (L) And what is a wanderer? <br />A: TP. <br />Q: (L) Well, the idea of the Wanderers, according to the Ra Material, is 4th or 5th density beings that have chosen to come back into 3rd density to help us. Would that be the same <br />kind of Wanderer? <br />A: 5th or 6th density.</p><p>Q: (L) Okay. Now, I would like to know, for the sake of all the Theosophists around the world, what was the source of the information in the book &quot;Isis Unveiled&quot; by Helena <br />Blavatsky? <br />A: Orions STS and STO. 6th Density. <br />Q: (L) So, her information was from both sides? And it is up to the reader to figure out which is which? <br />A: Good idea. <br />Q: (L) Is there any possibility that the information we get through this source is STS oriented? <br />A: Yes. Always possibility.</p></blockquote></div><div class="quotebox"><cite>Cass (Jan 7, 1995) wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Q: (L) Are there 6th density STS beings? <br />A: No, when you get to 6th you no longer need to recycle. <br />Q: (L) But still, is there an STS experience at 6th density, like the 6th density Orions? <br />A: These are only reflections of individuals, not unified entities. These reflections exist for balance. They are not whole entities, just thought forms.</p><p>Q: (L) So, there are STS and STO at 6th density which balance? And they are just there, they exist? <br />A: Reflection for balance.</p></blockquote></div><div class="quotebox"><cite>Cass (Aug 17, 2000) wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Q: (L) ...how can one identify a 5th density STS source?<br />A: Not often communicative.</p></blockquote></div><p>Not much more to go on really.&nbsp; I&#039;m not entirely sure yet.&nbsp; If an entity can get to 6d without the higher centers in place at all then what about the concept of OPs?&nbsp; Why would they require a &quot;second death&quot; after going back to 5d?&nbsp; Are not lower centers enough to allow for further &quot;living&quot;?&nbsp; Or is there a distinction being made by existence?&nbsp; The Cs stated that it was the human-soul&#039;s collective choice to experience physicality.&nbsp; They also once asked if we missed 2nd density.&nbsp; Did the 6d soul go to 2d and run through the soul-pool animal realm, then is currently (for the most part) at the 3d individualized realm?&nbsp; Is a distiction made between a 6d soul that chose 2d and some other soul-pool that may have been created just to maintain physical realm balance?&nbsp; Are the current human-souls that are being birthed, the recycled souls (in different soul configurations) of our ancestors that chose STS?&nbsp; Will this birth continue until all of the original 6d human soul unit makes it back to 6d STO?</p><p>In order for a soul to make it back to 6d would they already have had to have been from there as one of the first thought-form-units created by the universe?&nbsp; If so then all souls that make it to 5d and maintain would have the higher centers already?&nbsp; And STS would have <em>chosen</em> to separate self from these higher centers progressively (ignore the higher and concentrate on the lower exclusively)?&nbsp; And once these centers are completely shut off it would graduate to a reflective thought-form maintained specifically for balance?</p><p>I&#039;m going to have to contemplate on this some more.&nbsp; Any ideas or further comments anyone?</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[z3n3rg]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=945</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-09T11:08:06Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37090#p37090</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37087#p37087" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>I was a little confused by Mouravieff quoted above by Montalk. I dug into Boris Mouravieff Gnosis Book I Exoteric Cycle Chapter VI a little to try to find what was referenced in the quotes. I&#039;m adding this hoping it will add some clarity for someone else as well... (and I&#039;m trying to setup web accessible space for referencing images, trying imageshack this is an on-the-fly sort of a thing since I need it now).</p><div class="quotebox"><cite>Mouravieff wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Let us now examine from the practical point of view how man can reach esotericism; by what means he can work towards the aim of establishing permanent connections which will make it possible for him to evolve. The problem is treated in the Tradition by the help of the diagram below. In esoteric teaching this figure could be said to be the most important. It incorporates a multitude of ideas; far more than the comments we are about to give. That is why we must return to it often and meditate upon it.</p><p><span class="postimg"><img src="http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/3836/borismouravieffgnosisbookiexot.jpg" alt="http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/3836/borismouravieffgnosisbookiexot.jpg" /></span></p><p>The black arrows represent influences created within life by life itself, this is the first variety of influence by which man is surrounded. These are called &#039;A&#039; influences. We will notice that they are distributed almost equally over all the surface of the circle of life. As in the case of all radiant energy in nature, their effect is inversely proportional to the square of the distance; thus man is subject most of all to arrows influencing him from those immediately around him. He is pulled every instant by the way they act at that moment.</p><p>The influence of the &#039;A&#039; arrows on exterior man is imperative; driven, he wanders in the circle of his life from birth to death, following a broken line which is sometimes subject to dangerous changes of direction.</p><p>The ensemble of &#039;A&#039; influences forms the Law of Chance or Law of Accident. Man is subject to its rule, yet if we examine the figure more closely we will perceive that each black arrow is counterbalanced, neutralized in some other part by another arrow equal in force and diametrically opposed, so that if we had left them to effectively neutralize each other the resultant force would have been equal to zero. This means that in their ensemble the &#039;A&#039; influences are illusory in their nature, although the effect of each one of them is real, so that exterior man takes them for reality. The white circle represents the esoteric Centre, located outside the general laws of life.</p><p>The white arrows represent influences called &#039;B&#039;. These influences are thrown into the turmoil of life and originate from the esoteric Centre, treated outside life, these arrows are all oriented in the same direction. In their ensemble they form a sort of magnetic field.</p><p>Since &#039;A&#039; influences neutralize each other, &#039;B&#039; influences actually constitute the only reality.</p><p>The small circle with the shaded lines represents man, who in this figure is taken in isolation. The oblique shaded lines signify that the nature of exterior man is not homogeneous: it is mixed.</p><p>If man spends his life without distinguishing between &#039;A&#039; and &#039;B&#039; influences, he will end it as he started, one could say mechanically, driven by the Law of Accident. However, according to the nature and the intensity of the resultant forces to which he is subjected, it can happen to him to make a brilliant career, in the meaning the world gives to this expression.</p><p>Yet he will come to the end of his days without having either learned or understood anything of Reality. And earth returns to Earth.</p><p>In life, every being is subjected to a sort of competitive test. If he discerns the existence of the &#039;B&#039; influences; if he acquires a taste for gathering and absorbing them; if he continually aspires to assimilate them better; his mixed inner nature will slowly undergo a certain kind of evolution. And if the efforts which he makes to absorb the &#039;B&#039; influences are constant and sufficient in force, a magnetic centre can be formed within him. This magnetic centre is represented in the diagram by the small white space.</p><p>If this centre once born in him is carefully developed, it takes form, and in its turn will exercise an influence over the results of the &#039;A&#039; arrows which are always active, deflecting them. Such a deflection may be violent. In general it transgresses the laws of exterior life and provokes many conflicts in and around man. If he loses the battle, he emerges with the conviction that the &#039;B&#039; influences are nothing but illusion: that the only reality is represented by the &#039;A&#039; influences. Slowly the magnetic centre which had been formed within him is reabsorbed and vanishes. Then, from the esoteric point of view, his situation is worse than the one he had started with, when he was just beginning to discern the &#039;B&#039; influences.</p><p>But if he emerges a winner in this first struggle, his magnetic centre, consolidated and reinforced, will draw him to a man having a &#039;C influence stronger than his own, and possessing a stronger magnetic centre. And so on in succession, the last man being in connection with another having an influence &#039;D&#039;, who will be his link with the Esoteric Centre &#039;E&#039;.</p><p>Henceforth in life, that man will no longer be isolated. He will certainly continue to live as before under the action of the &#039;A&#039; influences, which for a long time will continue to exercise their power over him; yet little by little, thanks to the effect of the influence of the chain &#039;B&#039;-&#039;C&#039;-&#039;D&#039;-&#039;E&#039;, his magnetic centre will develop. To the measure of its growth, the man will escape the dominion of the Law of Chance and enter the domain of Consciousness.</p><p>If he reaches this result before his death, he can say that his life was not lived in vain.</p><p>Let us now examine a different version of the same diagram:</p><p><span class="postimg"><img src="http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/3836/borismouravieffgnosisbookiexot.jpg" alt="http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/3836/borismouravieffgnosisbookiexot.jpg" /></span></p><p>This second figure, with black magnetic centres, represents the situation where man deludes himself and, believing he is absorbing &#039;B&#039; influences and making the necessary selection all the while, he in fact absorbs &#039;A&#039; influences, those of the black arrows that are in some way parallel to the white arrows of the &#039;B&#039; influences. This will put him into contact with people who possess magnetic centres of the same nature: who are themselves duped or who dupe others, and who have no direct or indirect link with the esoteric Centre.</p></blockquote></div>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[sinaptix]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=537</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-09T10:04:05Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37087#p37087</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37082#p37082" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>That&#039;s hilarious, Pictus, forgot about <em>Chicken Run</em>...nice allegory about escaping oppression. </p><div class="quotebox"><cite>z3n3rg wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Specifically, do you think Ra is talking about the higher centers in self as the Higher Self or just about the 6d oversoul or social memory complex (SMC)?&nbsp; If they are talking about the SMC then maybe the higher centers do develop but with an inverted focus.&nbsp; I&#039;m currently leaning towards 4d/5d STS as having developed the higher centers with the same knowledge as 4d/5d STO but choosing to focus that knowledge inward instead of outward.</p></blockquote></div><p>I don&#039;t know. Maybe it&#039;s a case of the &quot;prodigal son&quot; where the higher STS entity exists in ignorance of its Higher Self but should it ever choose to flip polarity, due to its already gained soul strength, awareness, and wisdom it could easily merge with the Higher Self. </p><p>The question is what is it, exactly, that makes the higher STS entity &quot;higher&quot; - according to Ra it is, among other things, an efficient use of the &quot;yellow ray&quot; and &quot;orange ray&quot; energies to such intensity that it puts the entity in contact with &quot;intelligent infinity&quot;. Reminds me of something I read in the Falun Gong material where karma is said to keep one from attaining the higher powers naturally, but that if enough karma is intentionally accumulated then it becomes an alternate path to attaining special powers...which defines the left hand path of occultism. Anyway, the C&#039;s concept of FRV ties into this as well whereby low FRV is STSish and high FRV is STOish, and that 3D entities who are to become 4D STS must not only lower their FRV but intensify its amplitude so that it rings loud and heavy. Same for 4D STO candidates, they must raise their FRV and also make it pure and strong. Regular 3D folks are of mixed, inconstant, and weaker vibration. I&#039;m iffy on this. You may be right that the STS mode is simply an inverted use of the higher centers. </p><p>Well, here are some further excerpts from various sources regarding reaching a higher state of STS:</p><div class="quotebox"><cite>Ra wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Questioner: Is there anyone in our history who is commonly known who <br />went to a fourth-density self-service or negative type of planet or any who <br />will go there? </p><p>Ra: I am Ra. The number of entities thus harvested is small. However, a few <br />have penetrated the eighth level which is only available from the opening up <br />of the seventh through the sixth. Penetration into the eighth or intelligent <br />infinity level allows a mind/body/spirit complex to be harvested if it wishes <br />at any time/space during the cycle. </p><p>Questioner: Are any of these people known in the history of our planet by <br />name? </p><p>Ra: I am Ra. We will mention a few. The one known as Taras Bulba, the <br />one known as Genghis Khan, the one known as Rasputin. </p><p>Questioner: How did they accomplish this? What was necessary for them to <br />accomplish this? </p><p>Ra: I am Ra. All of the aforementioned entities were aware, through <br />memory, of Atlantean understandings having to do with the use of the <br />various centers of mind/body/spirit complex energy influx in attaining the <br />gateway to intelligent infinity. </p><p>Questioner: Did this enable them to do what we refer to as magic? Could <br />they do paranormal things while they were incarnate? </p><p>Ra: I am Ra. This is correct. The first two entities mentioned made little <br />use of these abilities consciously. However, they were bent single-mindedly <br />upon service to self, sparing no efforts in personal discipline to double, re- <br />double and so empower this gateway. The third was a conscious adept and <br />also spared no effort in the pursuit of service to self.</p></blockquote></div><div class="quotebox"><cite>Mouravieff wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>A magician&#039;s power - that of a Cagliostro, Rasputin and their like is <br />based, as we said, on excessive development of the motor centre, which <br />dominates the other two. The working of the intellectual centre is reduced <br />to what is strictly necessary to ensure vital needs and to elaborate projects;<br />its negative part is smothered, and this is what leads to the absence of<br />doubt. The emotional centre is not only not smothered but is rather well<br />developed. However, this development is unbalanced, as it is not the result<br />of correct discernment of &#039;B&#039; from &#039;A&#039; influences, but of the accumulation<br />of those of the latter whose action, although different in quality, lies parallel<br />to the &#039;B&#039; influences {false B-influence}. Lastly, an overgrowth on the psyche is formed on the<br />right side of the emotional centre of this type of man 1, which shows all the<br />characteristics of an impure or black magnetic centre. While the magnetic centre<br />formed of &#039;B&#039; influences is a subsidiary organ enabling esoteric development,<br />this black magnetic centre formed by &#039;A&#039; influences can clearly not be<br />oriented towards esoteric goals. Shaped by &#039;A&#039; influences whose action runs<br />parallel to the &#039;B&#039; influences, the orientation of this black magnetic centre is<br />automatically directed towards objectives limited to within the perimeter<br />of exterior life. These objectives are well known; money, women, and<br />power in all their forms.</p><p>This type of unbalanced development of Personality, which gives birth<br />to the sorcerer in all its aspects, is shown below: [diagram]</p><p>The reader will remember the diagram in chapter VI of the first volume<br />accompanied there by a brief explanation. Evidently the black<br />magnetic centre, instead of sending man forward towards the second Birth<br />and so towards the union of his Personality with his real &#039;I&#039; {Higher Self}, emphasizes and<br />crystallizes the &#039;I&#039; of the Personality and inspires it with the strength it<br />needs to impose itself on other Personalities who are in an unstable inner<br />state.</p><p>It is important to know that this human type exists, especially for those<br />who have an inclination for esoteric research and who begin by looking for<br />the &#039;marvellous.&#039; While awaiting an encounter with a guide, their Personality<br />is wide open to the influences emanating from this type of man, and<br />they may easily fall under his sway. Such a &#039;guide&#039; may be represented by<br />the diagram from the first volume we have just described. We reproduce it<br />here because of its great importance: [diagram]</p><p>The scriptures and authorized commentaries have drawn seekers&#039; attention<br />to this danger many times. This is why it is written that &#039;the children of<br />this world are more cunning than the children of light.&#039; Beginning long ago, many<br />warnings have been given about this.</p><p>Besides giving birth to magicians, this type of man gives rise to false<br />false Christs, and even the Antichrist.</p><p>It is curious to see how much these false prophets, magicians and<br />&#039;christs&#039;, impressed themselves on the imagination of the men -and even<br />more of the women of the past. It is the same today.</p><p>For there is a type of human being who declines all moral responsibility<br />for himself or for those to whom he is in duty bound. One comes across this<br />type quite often, always trying to find someone else to shoulder his responsibilities<br />as long as this someone else possesses some kind of authority,<br />earned or otherwise. These people are open to any form of hypnotic suggestion<br />and practically ask to be hypnotized. They are of good faith, but<br />they search for the &#039;marvellous&#039; because they are too weak or too lazy to<br />undertake esoteric work successfully. And the &#039;wolves&#039; devour them<br />finding justification in the fact that they are only the &#039;scourings of<br />humanity.&#039; But this is not true; for &#039;scourings&#039; who are converted can<br />become key figures on the esoteric chess-board.</p></blockquote></div><p>That last part about people who are too weak or lazy to undertake esoteric work successfully brings this discussion back to your original post about some potential problems with the New Age field. Mouravieff&#039;s use of the term &#039;marvelous&#039; is equivalent to &#039;woowoo&#039;. Those who seek the woowoo solely&nbsp; to be entertained, to plug some insecurity, or to make an identity for themselves risk getting into things they are not strong or discerning enough to handle. That&#039;s why the New Age movement is a playground for phoneys, because the whole &quot;feel, don&#039;t think&quot; axiom makes for easy prey. And not just the New Age, but other imbalanced or incomplete forms of mysticism or esotericism as well - including the &quot;think, don&#039;t feel&quot; axiom employed by groups that pride themselves on being counter-reactions to the New Age love&#039;n&#039;light movement. The latter shut themselves off from intuition and compassion, and as Mouravieff pointed out, without <em>heart</em> the higher centers remain inaccessible. For that reason, strictly thinking with a hammer can still get you nailed.</p><div class="quotebox"><cite>Mouravieff wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>However, there is a case which merits our special attention. It is the<br />deformation which, pushed to the extreme, makes the man a black magician<br />or false prophet, enabling him to acquire certain psychic powers.<br />The Personality&#039;s partial deformation in this sense also plays a role in life.<br />Constituted in this way, a man unknowingly acquires a certain influence<br />over those around him; hypnotic influences of the &#039;A&#039; kind emanate from<br />him. And this can happen not only to the man of type 1, but equally to types<br />2 and 3.</p><p>Someone who undertakes esoteric work seriously must guard against<br />these hypnotic influences which can emanate from him without his knowledge,<br />and which create new karmic burdens for him which he must later<br />neutralize by conscious efforts. There is yet another valid reason for distrusting<br />one&#039;s own hypnotic influences. The latter automatically look for<br />fertile ground: weak natures, generally not very deep, are open to them,<br />especially in women subject to a morbid mysticism sometimes accompanied<br />by certain sexual inclinations. When one gives in to them, these<br />influences only accentuate the degeneration of such natures.</p></blockquote></div><p>Also this from the Zhuan Falun (Falun Gong text)</p><div class="quotebox"><cite>Zhuan Falun wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>What does “practicing in an evil way&quot;&nbsp; mean? Well, there are a number of forms of it. </p><p>There’s a certain type of people who specifically do evil practices, and their stuff has <br />been passed down for generations. Why do they pass that stuff on? It’s because they want <br />to build up their reputations, benefit themselves, and get rich. That’s what they care <br />about. Of course, their character isn’t high, and they don’t get any gong. So what do they <br />get? Karma. When a person’s karma is huge, it can form a kind of energy. But his level is <br />nothing, and he’s nothing compared to a cultivator. He is able to have power over <br />ordinary people, though. That stuff is also a form of energy, so when its density gets very <br />high, it can strengthen the abilities that the human body has. It can have that kind of <br />effect. So there have always been people who teach that stuff. They say, “I do bad things, <br />I swear at people, and my gong grows right up.&quot;&nbsp; They aren’t building up their gong in the <br />least. The fact is, they’re just increasing the density of that black matter since doing bad <br />things gives them black matter, karma. So they can strengthen those few little tiny inborn <br />abilities with that karma and bring about some minor abilities, but they can’t do anything <br />big. These people think they can build up gong by doing bad things, that’s their theory.</p></blockquote></div><p>The point of this is to show that even without access to the higher centers it may still be possible to transcend 3D, but the perverted nature of that technique eventually catches up with the entity when its gravity increases to the point of implosion upon reaching the 5D/6D threshold. </p><div class="quotebox"><cite>z3n3rg wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Specifically, do you think Ra is talking about the higher centers in self as the Higher Self or just about the 6d oversoul or social memory complex (SMC)?</p></blockquote></div><p>Specifically concerning the Higher Selves of STS beings, here is a discussion about Himmler:</p><div class="quotebox"><cite>Ra wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Questioner: Let me take as an example the one that you said was called <br />Himmler. We are assuming from this that his higher self was of the sixth- <br />density and it was stated that Himmler had selected the negative path. <br />Would his higher self then dwell in a sixth-density negative type of <br />situation? Can you expand on this concept? </p><p>Ra: I am Ra. There are no negative beings which have attained the Oversoul <br />manifestation, which is the honor/duty of the mind/body/spirit complex <br />totality, of late sixth-density as you would term it in your time <br />measurements. These negatively oriented mind/body/spirit complexes have <br />a difficulty which to our knowledge has never been overcome, for after fifth- <br />density graduation wisdom is available but must be matched with an equal <br />amount of love. This love/light is very, very difficult to achieve in unity <br />when following the negative path and during the earlier part of the sixth- <br />density, society complexes of the negative orientation will choose to release <br />the potential and leap into the sixth-density positive. </p><p>Therefore, the Oversoul which makes its understanding available to all who <br />are ready for such aid is towards the positive. However, the free will of the <br />individual is paramount, and any guidance given by the higher self may be <br />seen in either the positive or negative polarity depending upon the choice of <br />a mind/body/spirit complex. </p><p>Questioner: Then using Himmler as an example, was his higher self at the <br />time he was incarnate in the 1940s a sixth-density positively oriented higher <br />self? </p><p>Ra: I am Ra. This is correct. </p><p>Questioner: Was Himmler in any way in contact with his higher self at that <br />time when he was incarnate during the 1940s? </p><p>Ra: I am Ra. We remind you that the negative path is one of separation. <br />What is the first separation: the self from the self. The one known as <br />Himmler did not choose to use its abilities of will and polarization to seek <br />guidance from any source but its conscious drives, self-chosen in the life <br />experience and nourished by previous biases created in other life <br />experiences. </p><p>Questioner: Well then let’s say that when Himmler reaches sixth-density <br />negative, would he realize that his higher self was positively oriented and for <br />that reason make the jump from negative to positive orientation? </p><p>Ra: I am Ra. This is incorrect. The sixth-density negative entity is extremely <br />wise. It observes the spiritual entropy occurring due to the lack of ability to <br />express the unity of sixth-density. Thus, loving the Creator and realizing at <br />some point that the Creator is not only self but other-self as self, this entity <br />consciously chooses an instantaneous energy reorientation so that it may <br />continue its evolution. </p><p>Questioner: Then the sixth-density entity who has reached that point in <br />positive orientation may choose to become what we call a Wanderer and <br />move back. I am wondering if this ever occurs with a negatively oriented <br />sixth-density entity? Do any ever move back as Wanderers? </p><p>Ra: I am Ra. Once the negatively polarized entity has reached a certain <br />point in the wisdom density it becomes extremely unlikely that it will <br />choose to risk the forgetting, for this polarization is not selfless but selfish <br />and with wisdom realizes the jeopardy of such “Wandering.&quot;&nbsp; Occasionally a <br />sixth-density negative becomes a Wanderer in an effort to continue to <br />polarize towards the negative. This is extremely unusual.</p></blockquote></div>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[montalk]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=2</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-09T05:21:40Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37082#p37082</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37080#p37080" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>montalk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>It&#039;s like flying - maybe in 3D we are like chickens at best, able to fly short distances, while in 4D we are like falcons soaring and doing aerobatics.</p></blockquote></div><p><img src="https://forum.noblerealms.org/img/smilies/lol.png" width="15" height="15" alt="lol" /> <img src="https://forum.noblerealms.org/img/smilies/lol.png" width="15" height="15" alt="lol" /> <img src="https://forum.noblerealms.org/img/smilies/lol.png" width="15" height="15" alt="lol" /><br /><span class="postimg"><img src="http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/4619/photo206vm.jpg" alt="http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/4619/photo206vm.jpg" /></span><br />Very good analogy and also very funny!<br /><strong>Montalk</strong> you rulez!!<br />It is a pleasure and an honour to read so good information from you guys!!!</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[Pictus]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=878</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-09T04:17:28Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37080#p37080</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37075#p37075" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>montalk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Thanks for that interesting post. I agree with how you correlated the centers to the densities. Actually, it would really make sense if each of the centers you listed corresponded to the lowest levels of that density and the highest of the previous.</p></blockquote></div><p>I&#039;ve never thought about that but it certainly makes sense.</p><br /><div class="quotebox"><cite>montalk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Concerning the absolute divisions, Fourth Way (and here I mean Gurdjieff/Ouspensky, not Mouravieff) says that we are 100% cut-off from our higher centers, that despite their working tirelessly we can know nothing of them until that distant day when the &quot;master arrives home.&quot; I think that is &quot;putting the cart before the horse&quot; because I have experienced enough accurate intuitions, instant-knowings, and rare moments of selfless compassion to know that despite my 3D existence the higher centers are there and come through in flashes, and that it&#039;s in&nbsp; seeking, nurturing, and sustaining these mini-illuminations - assimilating these B-influences - that eventually a fully self-sustaining state of illumination may eventually ignite.</p></blockquote></div><p>From that synopis, I agree.&nbsp; I haven&#039;t read too much G, O or M.&nbsp; Mostly just the quotes from others in the cass discussions.&nbsp; From what I can tell, the teachings <em>also</em> don&#039;t take into account an entity that has already made it to 5d and comes back to help in some way.&nbsp; I don&#039;t think they would lose their higher centers although I&#039;m sure the &quot;act of forgetting&quot; would make it difficult to remember them and use them.&nbsp; Also, what about a 3d entity with only lower centers that interacts with an incarnated 5d entity and is open to the teachings.&nbsp; For instance, Jesus teaching others.&nbsp; Maybe they covered different senarios such as this and I didn&#039;t read it.</p><br /><div class="quotebox"><cite>montalk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>...the H.I. even if only in glimpses, helps to frame lower intellectual knowledge in a higher absolute context.</p></blockquote></div><p>Excellent points.</p><br /><div class="quotebox"><cite>z3n3rg wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>STS love at a 3d level before recognition of something higher is a self-preservation love. [...]<br />STO love is not achieved until recognition is achieved.</p></blockquote></div><div class="quotebox"><cite>montalk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Okay, I guess then that love is an impulse that moves Creation forward, implying it differs depending on the stage and direction of individual evolution. The impulse that moves forward 4D STS evolution would be the same in essence, but different expression, from the impulse that moves anything else forward in its evolution. Like since self-preservation and procreation form the core of 2D growth, 2D love would be primarily of a carnal nature based on need.</p></blockquote></div><p>Yea, lower level love is a bit more difficult because the word love doesn&#039;t seem to have the right connotation when dealing with the lower levels.&nbsp; After reviewing my post <em>I think it might</em> go beyond mere self-preservation depending on how one would define the term.&nbsp; Obsession and jealousy are not self-preservation but could be described as lower level love (?).&nbsp; Desire?&nbsp; Or are these things just 4d STS teaching us about the H.E. from their perspective?&nbsp; I really don&#039;t know but I&#039;ll think more on it.&nbsp; So many words, definitions, connotations, interpretations;&nbsp; it all gets really sticky.&nbsp; It&#039;s really difficult to draw a line and say L.E. love is self-preservation and no more but maybe it is.&nbsp; Obsession, jealousy, desire, etc. didn&#039;t enter my mind before when I was thinking about the lower level love.&nbsp; Additional thoughts on this by others is most welcome.</p><br /><div class="quotebox"><cite>montalk wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Ever see &quot;The Chronicles of Riddick&quot;? That movie portrayed pretty well what I understand of 4D and 5D STS. You can tell that the &quot;bad guys&quot; in the film are not acting out of crude self-preservation, but a fervent devotion to a higher ideal. I do wonder though about the black magnetic center, because it is through <em>that</em> that one becomes a 4D STS candidate. See, according to the Ra Material the advanced STS individual has become increasingly cut off from his or her Higher Self. I&#039;m thinking perhaps the black magnetic center is what plugs them into the demonic or higher STS &quot;social memory complex&quot; which then substitutes for the Higher Self. I was wondering whether they are cut off from their H.E. but instead hooked up to something equally transcendental but STS oriented. You know, like the black hole / Ormethion thing sitting at the end of their evolution like some huge waterfall at the end of the river.</p></blockquote></div><p>Yes, I have seen it.&nbsp; You bring some interesting points and perspective.&nbsp; Specifically, do you think Ra is talking about the higher centers in self as the Higher Self or <em>just</em> about the 6d oversoul or social memory complex (SMC)?&nbsp; If they are talking about the SMC then maybe the higher centers do develop but with an inverted focus.&nbsp; I&#039;m currently leaning towards 4d/5d STS as having developed the higher centers with the same knowledge as 4d/5d STO but choosing to focus that knowledge inward instead of outward.&nbsp; But, it could go either way.&nbsp; Any further thoughts are most welcome.</p><p>I have a really long copy of an alledged channelling of an alledged higher level STS entity.&nbsp; If anyone is interested I&#039;ll post it.&nbsp; It&#039;s quite interesting.&nbsp; It also may have some parallels to understanding the STS side more.&nbsp; Then again, it may just be bunk.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[z3n3rg]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=945</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-09T03:25:02Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37075#p37075</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37062#p37062" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>z3n3rg wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>2d would be the moving center<br />3d would be the L.E. and L.I.<br />4d would be the H.E.<br />5d would be the H.I.</p><p>(The above is just a loose comparison between densities and centers.)</p></blockquote></div><p>Thanks for that interesting post. I agree with how you correlated the centers to the densities. Actually, it would really make sense if each of the centers you listed corresponded to the lowest levels of that density and the highest of the previous.</p><p>Example: L.E. represents the highest of 2D growth since advanced animals are very emotive, but the most basic of 3D since even the most infantile humans are emotionally active. Likewise, H.E. might be the pinnacle of 3D development but the most basic qualifier for 4D (at least STO) existence. H.I would be near the top of 4D refinement while also the fundamental to 5D, which would explain our expanded contemplative perspective when hanging out in 5D in between incarnations.</p><br /><div class="quotebox"><cite>z3n3rg wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Of course, the centers integrate in differing ways between 3d and 5d depending on the individual and the interactions from higher level entities.&nbsp; Some in 3d may not have developed the higher centers yet and some may have.&nbsp; Although 4d is the realm of love and compassion (H.E.) it does have and use the H.I. as well, of course.&nbsp; 5d is the contemplative zone and the balancing zone for the lessons learned in the lower densities but that doesn&#039;t exclude the other centers.&nbsp; It in fact combines all centers into one cohesive unit.&nbsp; But that can be accomplished in 3d as well.</p></blockquote></div><p>Yeah good point. I also believe the divisions are not clear cut and absolute. The higher centers can still be accessed intermittently, indirectly, in flashes while at a lower stage of development. For instance, if 4D involves full activation of the H.E., then even in 3D you can momentarily glimpse the H.E. when internal conditions are proper. It&#039;s like flying - maybe in 3D we are like chickens at best, able to fly short distances, while in 4D we are like falcons soaring and doing aerobatics. </p><p>Concerning the absolute divisions, Fourth Way (and here I mean Gurdjieff/Ouspensky, not Mouravieff) says that we are 100% cut-off from our higher centers, that despite their working tirelessly we can know nothing of them until that distant day when the &quot;master arrives home.&quot; I think that is &quot;putting the cart before the horse&quot; because I have experienced enough accurate intuitions, instant-knowings, and rare moments of selfless compassion to know that despite my 3D existence the higher centers are there and come through in flashes, and that it&#039;s in&nbsp; seeking, nurturing, and sustaining these mini-illuminations - assimilating these B-influences - that eventually a fully self-sustaining state of illumination may eventually ignite.&nbsp; </p><div class="quotebox"><cite>z3n3rg wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>The L.I. concerns itself with the mechanics of physical reality.&nbsp; It seeks to preserve self by gaining knowledge of it&#039;s environment.&nbsp; In our society, these mechanics involve what many refer to as the matrix control system.&nbsp; The L.I. can reach a &#039;point of seeing&#039; that there is something beyond it&#039;s capacity but it cannot gain access to that directly.&nbsp; In our society, the connection to physical creation is severely dampened which makes that &#039;point of seeing&#039; even more difficult.&nbsp; As StarCat points out, it keeps the L.I. busy in thought loops.</p></blockquote></div><p>After pondering what you said, another thing came to mind: the L.I. can only reason in relative terms, while the H.I. being an instrument of gnosis knows things in absolute terms. The L.I.&nbsp; can spot&nbsp; inconsistency, detect patterns, extrapolate from a given set of assumptions, compare and contrast&nbsp; different values, but has no grasp of absolute values - like a navigator without a compass...he knows forwards is opposite backwards, west is at right angles to south, but does not know what direction true north really is. You can see this flaw active in highly intellectual people who are out of touch with their intuition. Since they have no compass, they must rely on authority and group consensus to assume the absolutes for them, no matter how ridiculous it might be. In contrast, the H.I. even if only in glimpses, helps to frame lower intellectual knowledge in a higher absolute context. That is what Mouravieff called divine reasoning, while he referred to the intellectualists who were stunted at the L.I. level as <em>agnostic rationalists</em>. </p><div class="quotebox"><cite>z3n3rg wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>STS love at a 3d level before recognition of something higher is a self-preservation love. [...]<br />STO love is not achieved until recognition is achieved.</p></blockquote></div><p>Okay, I guess then that love is an impulse that moves Creation forward, implying it differs depending on the stage and direction of individual evolution. The impulse that moves forward 4D STS evolution would be the same in essence, but different expression, from the impulse that moves anything else forward in its evolution. Like since self-preservation and procreation form the core of 2D growth, 2D love would be primarily of a carnal nature based on need.</p><div class="quotebox"><cite>z3n3rg wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>STS love does come from the H.E. center only after recognition of the power within and the choice to expand that power by enslaving of others.&nbsp; Before this recognition and choice the STS love is from the L.E. center and is basically self-preservation.</p></blockquote></div><p>Ever see &quot;The Chronicles of Riddick&quot;? That movie portrayed pretty well what I understand of 4D and 5D STS. You can tell that the &quot;bad guys&quot; in the film are not acting out of crude self-preservation, but a fervent devotion to a higher ideal. I do wonder though about the black magnetic center, because it is through <em>that</em> that one becomes a 4D STS candidate. See, according to the Ra Material the advanced STS individual has become increasingly cut off from his or her Higher Self. I&#039;m thinking perhaps the black magnetic center is what plugs them into the demonic or higher STS &quot;social memory complex&quot; which then substitutes for the Higher Self. I was wondering whether they are cut off from their H.E. but instead hooked up to something equally transcendental but STS oriented. You know, like the black hole / Ormethion thing sitting at the end of their evolution like some huge waterfall at the end of the river.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[montalk]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=2</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-08T23:24:47Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37062#p37062</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37050#p37050" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>lyra wrote:</cite><blockquote><div class="quotebox"><cite>z3n3rg wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Woo-woo:&nbsp; Until coming to this forum about a month ago I had never heard of the term.&nbsp; As I currently understand it, the concept is the actions that resulted from the many teachings within the new age movement.&nbsp; The teachings themselves may not be bad or incorrect.&nbsp; However, the necessary steps to make the actions effective have been left out thus creating what results in inaction.&nbsp; Or more correctly, ineffectual action.&nbsp; For instance, visualizing light in the chakras.&nbsp; Since light is knowledge, visualizing light without the knowledge may produce some feeling but does nothing to help the entity learn the lessons.</p></blockquote></div><p>Woo-woo is a thing. It&#039;s the weird, the paranormal, the unexplained, and usually orchestrated by higher entities to get targets to sink into a fearful or paranoid low frequency, to get them to obsess in circles and get all worked up.&nbsp; Overall though it&#039;s a fun term that relates to the weird and unexplained.</p></blockquote></div><p>Thank you Lyra.&nbsp; I&#039;ve been using term incorrectly.&nbsp; I don&#039;t know of a term that has the definition I stated.&nbsp; I suppose something like the &quot;new-age effect&quot; will have to do.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[z3n3rg]]></name>
				<uri>https://forum.noblerealms.org/profile.php?id=945</uri>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-08T11:10:51Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37050#p37050</id>
		</entry>
		<entry>
			<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: Love and Light:  The Practical Guide]]></title>
			<link rel="alternate" href="https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37049#p37049" />
			<content type="html"><![CDATA[<p>Ignorance and Knowledge are one in the same.</p><p>The universe is infinite, therefore there are infintie possibilities and therefore infinite knowledge. If one possess knowledge in <strong>any</strong> single; significant form, then he is ignorant. </p><p>The darkness is the light.</p>]]></content>
			<author>
				<name><![CDATA[GrapeCaoDizzle]]></name>
			</author>
			<updated>2006-05-08T07:30:57Z</updated>
			<id>https://forum.noblerealms.org/viewtopic.php?pid=37049#p37049</id>
		</entry>
</feed>
