DURHAM, N.C. – Distant prayer and the bedside use of music, imagery and touch (MIT therapy) did not have a significant effect upon the primary clinical outcome observed in patients undergoing certain heart procedures, researchers at Duke Clinical Research Institute (DCRI), Duke University Medical Center, the Durham Veterans Affairs Medical Center (VAMC) and seven other leading academic medical institutions across the U.S. have found. Therapeutic effects were noted, however, among secondary measures such as emotional distress of patients, re-hospitalization and death rates. [...] (emphasis added)

Source: http://dukemednews.duke.edu/news/article.php?id=9136

Okay, maybe it's just pissed-off spirits in the air today, but this thread triggered an old peeve of mine concerning the multitude of "Miracle" TV shows that were in vogue a while back. The ones where someone is trapped with time running out or is sick. The one constant theme I noticed was that the other participants would always pray to Jesus for help, and then the victim would escape/recover/whatever. I know it's understandable for a person, when confronted by extreme adversity, to pray for whatever help is needed, but the theme was so blatantly Christian that I felt a genuine sense of satisfaction while reading your article. It's unworthy, but at the same time it all felt like a sort of programming was being imprinted with the show, that only Christians would get helped by miracles, since they never bothered to show the miracles of people from other faiths being answered.

Misty morning, clouds in the sky
Without warning, the wizard walks by
Casting his shadow, weaving his spell
Funny clothes, tinkling bell

Never talking
Just keeps walking
spreading his magic

Evil power disappears
Demons worry when the wizard is near
He turns tears into joy
Everyone's happy when the wizard walks by

Never talking
Just keeps walking
spreading his magic

Sun is shining, clouds have gone by
All the people give a happy sigh
He has passed by, giving his sign
Left all the people feeling so fine

Never talking
Just keeps walking
spreading his magic

I'm thinking of "Type A" personalities who live a fast and stressful life too busy to make room for matters of the heart. If the end result is an unintended consequence of choices that result from and exacerbate the very thing needed to benefit from nonphysical healing - a warm and willing heart - what good would distant prayer do for them? Nothing as far as I know. It goes contrary to everything that's common sense in metaphysics.

This study is an example of ignorance. So the patient does nothing but "get things done to them" while the underlying pattern bringing them to this state persists. Even worse, there is no mention of what types of prayers specifically were sent. Was it a powerless begging like "Dear God, please heal this person"? Man...reminds me of caveman scientists rubbing wet sticks together to prove friction doesn't make fire.

But yes, this study suggests that praying to change those who are not willing to change themselves leaves much to be desired. If violating freewill were that easy, killing someone by praying for their demise should be just as successful. The very thing that prevents the latter is what prevents healing of the non-willing. Nonphysical assistance should work better for the willing who are doing all they can and just need a little boost.

DURHAM, N.C. – Distant prayer and the bedside use of music, imagery and touch (MIT therapy) did not have a significant effect upon the primary clinical outcome observed in patients undergoing certain heart procedures, researchers at Duke Clinical Research Institute (DCRI), Duke University Medical Center, the Durham Veterans Affairs Medical Center (VAMC) and seven other leading academic medical institutions across the U.S. have found. Therapeutic effects were noted, however, among secondary measures such as emotional distress of patients, re-hospitalization and death rates. [...] (emphasis added)

Source: http://dukemednews.duke.edu/news/article.php?id=9136

The Stuart Wilde quote began "I breathe love into people's hearts...."

The first part "I breathe love..." is great.

I believe the next part, "...into people's hearts..." is invasive.

I second that!

The first part "I breathe love..." is great.

I believe the next part, "...into people's hearts..." is invasive.

I was taught early the basic metaphysical etiquette, and number one is: never pray for someone unless they ask you specifically to do so, because that is an invasion of their mental privacy, and none of your business.

The first impulse I felt was to protest against that. But I figured the statement is absolutely right. I initially thought, prayer is not forcing willpower upon anyone because it lets higher positive forces decide what to do about the “problem" of another being. But I think prayer is not much more than a decisive declaration towards the universe to be ready to receive help – to be open for it, since benevolent energy/beings is all around us. Praying for people who didn’t ask for it, would mean that you determine for them that they are ready to be “helped" . Thanks for posting that!

Do you ever give up???  "Last word Lyra"....Why do you have a need to prove points?......

Because you brought the points up to begin with when you "anonymously" quoted from our email exchange.  I didn't start this.  You did.  Take responsibility for that.   If you don't want somebody to prove points to you, then don't instigate a dialogue with them in the first place and put them in that position where they will respond to you, and "prove points."

Also, people usually say what you've said here when they've gotten themselves into a jam, and now want to wiggle out of it and pretend it didn't happen.  Rather than simply addressing the points that have been made, and admitting to any obvious errors or logical fallacies, they instead do what you did.

It's a bit of a tangled mess, isn't it?   What you say here seems to make sense, and if I was an outsider reading this I'd go, Oh, I see what she's saying, I get what happened here...........but the problem is, this doesn't mesh/match up with what was told to me in the emails and by whom.   Things are changing as it goes along.   And we'll leave it at that, because this is getting surreal at this point.

What did you think could happen when you "anonymously" quoted me from an email exchange, baiting me in an underhanded way, while leaving out the context of why I would have said that to you in an email?   When you do that, you'll get called out to the forum.   If you don't want to be called out, then don't play that way.

Sure. Let me help you though, save you the trouble:

scorpio948@yahoo.com
carissaconti@yahoo.com

Absolutely.  But if you're trying to imply that this exchange - initiated by you, mind you - is somehow an example of me not respecting people's rights, then I think you may have your concepts confused. 

Now, it's back to the self-imposed "Read Only" corner for me. 

Do you ever give up??? "Last word Lyra" You said someone from my "Group" slimed someone and I said "No one from my group emailed. Maybe I didn't make it clear enough. For heavens sake - you are a persistent one. R U thick? 

OK I am a single lady with two incredible sons
We have the house networked - all on line at the same time
One son is currently in Taiwan doing post doc work
The second one is home but planning to leave
No other people in our house!!!!!!!!!!!
I had a family member staying with me
She used our computers duh!
She has since gone home
She is a member of NR
We tried to delete ourselves but there is no function for deleting members
She emailed you first
I also emailed you
You replied several times
Maloros is my email
young loraine is not my email
Nice to know privacy is not respected here
Should I post your email address?
No member of my group lives in my house!!!!!!!!!!!
My group is a local one made up of very caring people
Most are not online and wouldn't dream of "Sliming " people
They wouldn't know what it meant anyway
I would not insult them relating your ****
The group is not called Mavis
Mavis is a person - namely me
We don't "love bomb" people
We respect peoples rights
Do you?

You have let your imagination run wild
Get your facts straight and it wont happen

You are what psychologists call projecting
Google it

Why do you have a need to prove points?
Yes, you are right - It should be the end but I suspect you will keep it going ad nauseum

I repeat - you are a very troubled person

How simpler could this be?

Keep going if you want.

First Mavis wrote (in the post that kicked off this entire back and forth fiasco):

Then Mavis wrote......

!!!!!!!!!

If your group never emailed me.......then where else did that admonishment come from?

??

Or will it be more deflecting attention onto any other poster who happens to post here? 

wow.  This whole thing is just trippy and surreal at this point.   I don't think I've ever encountered something like this on NR....!   I'm not sure how many people we're dealing with when we talk to "Mavis", but seriously, you guys gotta get it together.    You're either lying, or somebody is clearly out of the loop about who's emailing who on your shared computer in your shared living house.

Hey Pokerboy

Ya got our number. Ya right. I sense your very intelligent.

Thank you!

But honestly.....I'm just really stoned.....so I'm not too terribly wrapped up in my ego right now.

If it weren't for that....I'd prolly try to insert myself in this drama....

Oops....I kinda just did.   lol!

Ya got our number. Ya right. I sense your very intelligent.

Y'all are trippin'!